Could someone tell me?
Here's a quote from a sermon at Faith Word Baptist Church in Tempe, AZ:
... you're going to tell me that I'm supposed to pray for the socialist devil, murderer, infanticide, who wants to see young children and he wants to see babies killed through abortion and partial-birth abortion and all these different things -- you're gonna tell me I'm supposed to pray for God to give him a good lunch tomorrow while he's in Phoenix, Arizona?
Nope. I'm not gonna pray for his good. I'm going to pray that he dies and goes to hell.
Source: Pastor Of Gun-Toter At Obama Event Prayed For Obama To Die
I really do not understand this kind of thinking from a man who is supposed to care for the souls of all people.
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Blogs by dharmaseeker:
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| What has happened to Christianity? |
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MrPaul
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Aug 28 @ 6:34PM
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Sounds like HE has issues.  . I would not say he is a christian  or that he speaks for Christianty 
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Tunes4u
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Aug 28 @ 6:42PM
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Excellent comment from Paul... 
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burnslikethesun
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Aug 28 @ 6:42PM
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Like most beliefs, the morals get lost in the message.
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burnslikethesun
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Aug 28 @ 6:43PM
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It happens when Do as I say and not as I do, actually is taken to heart.
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kevnbrady
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Aug 28 @ 6:50PM
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Very good question ;o) To start let's break down a little bit of the word Christian....on a short explanation, being a Christian is for us to be Christ-like or likened unto Christ's walk on earth. The reason for the on-going decline in Christianity is known to be from today's media,television shows, scientific community,etc which diligently try to get people to believe there is no God,heaven,or hell to even worry about and that this world was created by a 'big bang' (if there was a 'big bang' then God constructed it). The main problem with their theory is that they pitifully still can't explain where the 2 minute particles came from which somehow found each other in the huge vastness of some form of blackness and then collided to created the WHOLE universe and everything within it. The other odd thing is that when confronting them on this issue, they start being evasive by changing the subject.
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sloriver
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Aug 28 @ 6:59PM
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I think Christianity has the same problem most religeons do. They are intolerant of other beliefs. It's their way or you're going to hell. Obviously heaven was there for Jews before Christ was born. I have difficulty believing it's not there for them now. I'm not sure what God wants from us, if anything. I'll find out in less than a century. In the meantime, I resent some bigotted lowbrow telling me I'm in danger of "hell" or that Obama is the antichrist.
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MrPaul
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Aug 28 @ 7:00PM
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We all need inner peace and we ALL have the right to find our path to it  Burns good point  and dharma a kudo to you for being the good man you are 
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kevnbrady
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Aug 28 @ 7:02PM
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"Nope. I'm not gonna pray for his good. I'm going to pray that he dies and goes to hell".....well I hope and pray that this person knows that vengence is Mine (God's) sayeth the Lord Thy God and for any person to damn anyone to hell, is blasphemous when God made it clear that He and no person damns NO ONE....man damned/damns themselves by refusing the Holy Sprit into their life.
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dharmaseeker
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Aug 28 @ 7:07PM
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Thanks MrPaul, I try.
I remember distinctly many Sunday School lessons as a kid, "pray for your enemies..." not against them.
Honestly, this kind of stuff coming from a Baptist church absolutely freaks me out. I was raised Baptist. My family is all still Baptist. I'm confused.
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SweetNapaGuy
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Aug 28 @ 7:10PM
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The problem with Christianity is that there are a LOT of people who call themselves Christians, who would spit on Jesus if he dared to tell them how to act. Rather than trying to adapt their life and how they live it to the message brought forth by Jesus, they pick-and-choose the portions of the message to support their prejudices.
It's a problem with organized religion. There's going to be people who join, simply because their neighbors or their parents are members. Only a tiny fraction actually live the message, the rest think it's enough to just feel self-righteous and put their butts in the pews once a week.
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southernlass
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Aug 28 @ 7:22PM
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Praying that someone will die and go to hell is absurd. First of all, it's unlikely to come about because God draws those He knows have a chance to Him. And I believe Christians should pray for those who need God because we're asking God for His mercy .. will this matter? I don't know but it's possible.
Christ returned goodness for hate; this is perhaps the most difficult of things to do and is the greatest challenge for all Christians to learn. I think when we truly master this one, we've learned the majority of what Christ wanted from us as followers of Him.
Some of us do this better than others. This takes much practice and an understanding that pride is foolish and is of this world not the next. I'm still in elementary school, in this regard, because it's tough for me not to fight back when people insult and degrade my personal beliefs or when they insult me because of my personal beliefs, but I'm aware of what I need to work on and this is the first step in mastering it!
Great blog, Dharma!
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travelwoman
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Aug 28 @ 8:24PM
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The pastor you cite is NOT a Christian....
Like SNG says...
The problem with Christianity is that there are a LOT of people who call themselves Christians, who would spit on Jesus if he dared to tell them how to act. Rather than trying to adapt their life and how they live it to the message brought forth by Jesus, they pick-and-choose the portions of the message to support their prejudices. The problem with Christians is that they are often none better than any average non-Christian, but they think they are. They think they can judge and condemn other people.
But God said "let vengeance be mine".
Also, many Christiand are unfortunately so absorbed with judging others, that they don't have time to see their own iniquities.....
I've talked with a "nice Christian" person yesterday. She talked about the illegal people in California and how it is their fault that California is bankrupt. Without blinking, she said that there should be no health care whatsoever for any illegals...
So I reminded her that we are supposed to be Christians and said... "as a Christian, I would have a hard time not to help sick children and their mothers...."
But that's what it seems to have come to:
Pray that somebody goes to hell, let children die without healthcare because their parents chose to be illegals....
Yikes! What a nasty storefront we have, we, the Christians...
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Kentuck
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Aug 28 @ 8:47PM
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There has always been a war between good and bad. If you are a Christian, then read our bible. For there will always be beares of false information, false gods, false preachers.
If you look back over the years. The bobic comet group, the jones group, Waco, the ministors who carry and sell guns and have their on militia. The mormans who use religion to have more than one wife and enslave children for the benifit of the man.
This is just another loud mouth that the weak at mind follow and listen to.
Like Fox media did not know the operations of a church
You see it is how people are brain washed to believe lies by false people.
You may say the many Anti-Christ are here. Just look at some of the replies to this blog
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dharmaseeker
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Aug 28 @ 9:26PM
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I listened to part of the sermon. Couldn't handle all of it. It's on page that's linked. Then I called my fundamentalist brother. He said it was terrible. "You won't want to hear this," he said, knowing I'm Buddhist, "but it's the sign of the times."
This guy uses dozens of Bible verses to "show" how God does not love everybody, that God hates some people from the time they are born. It was a really nasty sermon with the title "Why I hate Barak Obama."
Sad. Very sad.
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Jankia
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Aug 28 @ 9:37PM
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To many think its allright to sin because eventually,through confession... we are forgiven for it.
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southernlass
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Aug 28 @ 11:31PM
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I think Christianity has the same problem most religeons do. They are intolerant of other beliefs. It's their way or you're going to hell.
Hmm. This is odd. You're essentially blaming CHRISTIANS for what the religion teaches, via the Bible. It is not Christians who are intolerant; they are merely attempting to live and abide by what the entire bible says and it's the bible itself that states that one will go to hell if they have not believed on the Lord Jesus Christ, along with several other things. As much as one may not desire to believe this, it's the truth.
One cannot blame Christians because Jesus Christ, the word of God, teaches that there are specific things one must do if he or she desires to have eternal life and stay out of hell. I can understand if you're angry with Jesus or God or even the Bible itself, but why on earth do you blame Christians for merely following the bible and perhaps making clear what is says in plain english?
It is intolerant to expect that we'll change the bible or the fundamentals of our religion because you think it's intolerant.
Obviously heaven was there for Jews before Christ was born. I have difficulty believing it's not there for them now. I'm not sure what God wants from us, if anything. I'll find out in less than a century. In the meantime, I resent some bigotted lowbrow telling me I'm in danger of "hell" or that Obama is the antichrist.
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southernlass
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Aug 28 @ 11:32PM
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And when I said this:
"As much as one may not desire to believe this, it's the truth. "
I meant, that it's the truth FOR ME. It's the truth, FOR CHRISTIANS..
It is what we believe.
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southernlass
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Aug 28 @ 11:37PM
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Obviously heaven was there for Jews before Christ was born. I have difficulty believing it's not there for them now. I'm not sure what God wants from us, if anything. I'll find out in less than a century. In the meantime, I resent some bigotted lowbrow telling me I'm in danger of "hell" or that Obama is the antichrist.
Ooops..seems there's no way to edit comments. Answering the rest of what the gent said above here:
In the meantime you resent a Christian telling you what God's word, the bible, says. The bible says you're in danger of hell if you don't believe. It doesn't say that President Obama is the anti-christ; that is a personal matter which we can each determine for ourselves. I don't think enough time has passed yet to know if Obama is the antichrist. Someone will be -- I think we'll know if he gets re-elected and starts doing things which are antichrist-like.
Anyway, you can resent being told that you're in danger of hell but when we're in a discussion on religion, it's likely to come up when one is discussing Christianity, the bible, and Jesus Christ. I'm sorry it upsets you.
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kevnbrady
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Aug 29 @ 12:13AM
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Hmmmmm when saying that Heaven was created for the Jews before Christ was even born, I think this may be misunderstood a little....although the Jews are God's chosen people and eventually refused to believe there was or can even be a son of God, LONG before Christ was even born God gave the Ten Commandments and the practice of animal sacrifice to Moses for the purposes of ALL man kind who would harken unto them would to go to Heaven. I may have misunderstood some things on this subject as well but it was my understanding that Christ said near His time of death that His blood replaces the need for sacrificing unto God and He was going to prepare a place (heaven) for all of who who would come to the Father thru/by His Son's blood on the cross.
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SweetNapaGuy
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Aug 29 @ 3:11AM
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I remember, in my formative years, that there is a passage (in John?) where Satan takes Jesus to the heights and offers him control of the world, if he'll just bow down and worship Satan.
Jesus refused.
Seems like the Church leaders, back in the 4th century, should have read that verse. They took the Devil's bargain, exchanging the purity of their message for temporal power. The Church was made the state religion, but in return, the state had a hand in the compiling of the Bible, and in the dogma taught.
And the Church leaders got a taste of power, and many found that they loved power more than they loved Jesus. The Church became less a mission of conversion through acts of love, and more a mission of conversion through coercion.
And we have that legacy even today.
The greatest joke the Devil ever played was not convincing us that he didn't exist. It was in corrupting the Church founded in Jesus's name.
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Always_Striving
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Aug 29 @ 3:31AM
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This is one of the reasons why I don't attended church.
I prefer to have thoughts and praises for what God is allowing me to experience privately.
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misschoos
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Aug 29 @ 5:40AM
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Well if anyone can start a church in America, 'anyone' will.
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SweetNapaGuy
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Aug 29 @ 6:39AM
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Keeping in mind, England and the Commonwealth countries DO have a movement to create the Jedi church... 
So it's not just America.
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observed50
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Aug 29 @ 8:42AM
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Ancient books and our reliance on them mean we each get to determine what is a god, what that god does, believes, thinks, feels...the whole kit and kaboodle. We want so badly to believe a god is not us...but how is a god not us, since we each are free to paint gods face and put on its costume in any manner we desire that will make us feel safe, secure, righteous and hopefully eternal against our fear of death?
Words are abstractions...signs...pointing at what is real...
but they are not that reality.
So Baptist? Christian? Buddhist? Aren't they all empty vessels of our attempt to join with others in some identification that gives us solace and center? And the ancient texts...aren't they our excuse for not looking into the eyes of the suffering, the different, the disenfranchised, the powerless, the lost and asking them...how can we love them, now, today, in this moment?
Christians joined Hitler in slaughtering Jews. They went before the US Cavalry in the slaughter and theft of a nation. They found text to explain the selling of human beings and their continued slavery (Southern Baptist Church arose in that explanation).
We could do that littany with each religion. Texts, priesthoods, in the service of 'our' greater glory, not a god's.
And then we could line up all the human beings that argue "that isn't really Christianity, Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism...etc" as we cling to believing that it isn't about belief itself, or belief in ancient texts and words...it's about THOSE PEOPLE and both their distortion of ancient texts AND they aren't choosing the right text.
Take a look around. Notice how Bush thought he was doing a god's work and fascinatingly, so was his spiritual twin, Osama. Reagan thought he was. The believers and benefactors of Apartheid did. So did the Catholics and Protestants in Northern Ireland. Does anyone doubt the Orthodox Jews belief that their land theft is not linked to their belief in a god's ordination of land theft and denial of personhood to Palestinians, or the fundamentalist core of Hamas thanking a god for killin Jews?
And somehow...we want to believe it's not about our desire to believe itself???
It's just about...bad people. The religions are okay. People aren't.
Funny thing about that...religions simply are people. Beliefs on paper are nothing. But beliefs in the hands of human beings, are justified blood on the house walls I've stolen from the 'other.'
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unionman154
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Aug 29 @ 9:18AM
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That pastor will die a slow miserable death on his road to hell.
How do I know?
Cause my Bible tells me so. 
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yashaenka
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Aug 29 @ 9:27AM
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If you look at Buddhism as Hinduism stripped down for export you can view through different eyes. If you look at Hinduism as being based on the Aryians of old from Persia and ancient Greek who brought a earth based religion with them into India and that was the foundation of Indian belief at it's core you can see Hinduism through new eyes.
If you would bother reading the Real Historical Sources of Christianity you would view Christianity through different eyes when you realize there were several revision to Christianity over time as well as the bible. This link will walk you through the actual history from pre 1290 BC to the present day.The real source of Christianity
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dharmaseeker
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Aug 29 @ 9:56AM
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Clearly this preacher is off his rocker. The troublesome, even terrifying part, is that the preacher is not alone. I googled Christian Obama Hate and the results are horrid.
The absolutely most confusing and destructive part of Christianity is their clinging to the Hebrew scriptures and adopting it as if it belongs with the teachings of Christ. Everything relating to the pure teaching of Christ is corrupted when people reach back into the convoluted volumes of Hebrew writing that do not agree with each other.
This preacher used an assortment of one-liners to justify his hatred taken from Hebrew texts and then took a few New Testament verses out of context. He obviously ignored the greatest teaching from the greatest teacher in Christianity, Christ himself, and even that of Paul in 1 Corinthians.
I am not worried about the original sources of the Christian texts (which is the NT only), their authenticity nor their level of "inspiration." If they, alone, were the foundation of Christianity the religion would be as it should be.
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