One of the most annoying parts of debating politics is the constant misinformation against which one must vie. It is extremely difficult to convince someone to be rational, when they believe in kooky conspiracy and tabloid journalism websites.
I've only had experience from the last ten years or so. It's been my impression that the liberals and moderates generally approach things from a perspective of "Occam's Razor," that in the absence of compelling EVIDENCE (not innuendo, not supposition, not paranoia), the simplest explanation is often the most likely.
A lot of conservatives feel this way, I'm sure. I even remember debating some back in the early days of this decade. Now, though? Where are the rational conservatives, skeptical of the rantings of paranoid fringers?
Ah, politics. It's a never-ending burden...
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| The misinformation of American politics |
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musicianfriend
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Sep 4 @ 3:02AM
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Where are the rational conservatives, skeptical of the rantings of paranoid fringers?
Were still here...trying to fight off a totalitarian communist gov...
Obama has filled his administration with communists..socialists...ex terrorists...
I dont know about you...but I dont even know these kinds of people...never have..never will.
So you see Napa..were busy ....theres alot of work to do...this present gov. is sneaky and tricky....trying to sell us on lies and hoaxes..such as Global Warming in order to steal away our freedoms our money and our property....
Crap and Traider bill...would have devestated us in huge taxes....that were to be used to fund the United Nations armies..
If you dont know this....you should...so dont call me any of your stupid names....
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musicianfriend
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Sep 4 @ 3:06AM
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Im utterly amazed at the rationalizing that goes on by liberals....
this pres has not proven his citizenship...but thats ok....but if it were a Rep..then all hell would be breaking loose..
This Pres surrounds himself...and ALWAYS HAS ...with terrorists..communists...marxists...and you think that Im crazy because this bothers me?
Well then...perhaps YOU are a marxist...commie..or socialists yourself...
Just because people dont accept your destructive liberal values...doesn not make us wrong...
This nation was made great on conservative values...
Liberals have had control for only a few decades...and look at the mess we are already in...
I dont think the nation will make it another 200 years under liberalism..
I will be glad when this nightmare is freaking over...these people are destroying our beautiful America...
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SweetNapaGuy
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Sep 4 @ 3:10AM
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Case in point.
The above poster is thoroughly convinced that every evil person in the country (by which she means "people who have a lot of money") is in on one big conspiracy to take over the government. When in fact, there are multiple factions who are competing for power, and none of them (at least, those who aren't irrational nincompoops) so gauche as to want to take over the world.
But something as prosaic as "rich people are STILL people, with the same flaws and weaknesses" will ever get through her skull. Much easier (and much more gratifying to her tremendous ego) to imagine that she's deciphered the TRUE conspiracy behind dozens of competing interests, millions of coincidences, and thousands of innocent actions.
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musicianfriend
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Sep 4 @ 3:14AM
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 your just ignorant...uninformed......
Millions and millions of people see what I see...
Whats your problem.....probably to scarey for you? Or you cant think that big..
Even Rockerfeller...Bush....both of them ...Kissinger..Obama have all talked about it...where have you been?
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SweetNapaGuy
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Sep 4 @ 3:16AM
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Well then...perhaps YOU are a marxist...commie..or socialists yourself..
Another case in point. When this poster first appeared in the forums, she accused anyone who disagreed with her of being paid agents of the Obama/NWO conspiracy, sent to the nearly comatose political forums of MatchDoctor to specifically target her. I believe her list of "suspects" had reached about a dozen before even SHE realized how ridiculous she sounded. (It's not because she got tired of repeating the same charge. One thing we've learned is she has absolutely no problem being a broken record, repeating the same ridiculous, unsupported, paranoid claims again, and again, and again, and again, and 500 times again...)
Now, of course, anyone who isn't her brand of ultra-conservative fundamentalist anti-government anti-American conspiracy theorist is OBVIOUSLY a Commie. Because only the far right 5% of the nation gets to decide who can be a citizen, right? (She's seriously spoken of deporting anyone who's in the left 60% of the nation. AFTER the great murderous purge of anyone who makes enough to be in the top 1% of all income earners...)
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SweetNapaGuy
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Sep 4 @ 3:29AM
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Even Rockerfeller...Bush....both of them ...Kissinger..Obama have all talked about it...where have you been?
Here's the point of confusion. You imagine that, when they (or anyone who isn't a part of the fringe conspiracy theorists) talk about the "New World Order," they mean that it's some single monolithic conspiracy to take over the world and enslave all the people (starting, of course, with yourself... got to make yourself feel significant, right?).
Whereas in reality, it's either a recognition of the current status quo ("with the end of the Cold War, we have a new world order") or a hope that the world can be made better with a little cooperation.
The belief that, in the wake of the nationalism that swept the world over the last several hundred years, a world government could conceivably come about without hundreds of years of preparation...? Simply madness.
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SweetNapaGuy
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Sep 4 @ 3:41AM
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Domhoff writes in a March 2005 essay entitled There Are No Conspiracies:
There are several problems with a conspiratorial view that don't fit with what we know about power structures. First, it assumes that a small handful of wealthy and highly educated people somehow develop an extreme psychological desire for power that leads them to do things that don't fit with the roles they seem to have. For example, that rich capitalists are no longer out to make a profit, but to create a one-world government. Or that elected officials are trying to get the constitution suspended so they can assume dictatorial powers. These kinds of claims go back many decades now, and it is always said that it is really going to happen this time, but it never does. Since these claims have proved wrong dozens of times by now, it makes more sense to assume that leaders act for their usual reasons, such as profit-seeking motives and institutionalized roles as elected officials. Of course they want to make as much money as they can, and be elected by huge margins every time, and that can lead them to do many unsavory things, but nothing in the ballpark of creating a one-world government or suspending the constitution.
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SweetNapaGuy
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Sep 4 @ 3:42AM
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Mark C. Partridge, a contributing editor to the global affairs magazine Diplomatic Courier, writes in a December 2008 news article entitled One World Government: Conspiracy Theory or Inevitable Future?:
I am skeptical that “global governance” could “come much sooner than that [200 years],” as Gideon posits. For one thing, nationalism—the natural counterpoint to global government—is rising. Some leaders and peoples around the world have resented Washington’s chiding and hubris over the past two decade of American unipolarity. Russia has been re-establishing itself as a “great power”; few could miss the national pride on display when China hosted the Beijing Olympics this summer; while Hugo Chavez and his ilk have stoked the national flames with their anti-American rhetoric. The departing of the Bush Administration could cause this nationalism to abate, but economic uncertainty usually has the opposite effect. [...] Another point is that attempts at global government and global agreements have been categorical failures. The WTO’s Doha Round is dead in the water, Kyoto excluded many of the leading polluters and a conference to establish a deal was a failure, and there is a race to the bottom in terms of corporate taxes—rather than an existing global framework. And, where supranational governance structures exist, they are noted for their bureaucracy and inefficiency: The UN has been unable to stop an American-led invasion of Iraq, genocide in Darfur, the slow collapse of Zimbabwe, or Iran’s continued uranium enrichment. That is not to belittle the structure, as I deem it essential, but the system’s flaws are there for all to see
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musicianfriend
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Sep 4 @ 4:50AM
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Your talking to yourself..
Id write something...but you wouldnt like it ..
Anyway...were divorced..
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SweetNapaGuy
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Sep 4 @ 5:08AM
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Just goes to show you, you have no tolerance for any man who is rational enough to disagree with you... (Granted, any rational man would grow weary of the paranoid rants within minutes...)
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RightWingRepublican
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Sep 4 @ 8:02AM
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Where are the rational conservatives, skeptical of the rantings of paranoid fringers? 
I don't think there's conspiracy going on. And i also don't typically believe the rantings of most people. I just like to add my own feelings to the usual conspiracy grind.
I believe that all of us need to take it upon ourselves to either be there or know someone who has. If it's some Political rally where people are claiming "this and that happened", i want to talk to those people... not listen to what the Media is pumping us.
It's like knowing that a friend of yours is a compulsive liar. You know it for sure but you still listen to their stories without ever calling them out on the lying.
Let's all stop doing that.
The only conspiracy i know is that Fox and CNN like to pit us against each other. They are both liars of the worst kind.
In this day and age, it's not hard to track people down. If there's a story about an event that is taking place, whether it be a Town Hall meeting or a protest... get in touch of the people who were THERE. Not too hard. Ive done it a dozen times.
Put down the remote and go find out for yourself.
That was my two cents.
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observed50
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Sep 4 @ 8:26AM
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In the context of fear, generated by change and an increasing dis-ease with the direction of social forms around one, it is far easier for any mind to follow what assuages the fear, as opposed to what kills it.
We learn as children to carry our parents fears, about life and death, morality, money, and 'those other people,' to name a few of the big ones. We learn to interpret the world through lifting those fears as real, and facts as immaterial - "Why would God allow Timmy to die? He was only 5? And in such a horrible way?" "God must have wanted Timmy close to him more than have him down here spreading his love."
As the pieces of those learned fears intersect, with their learned tools of mis-interpretation of reality into the fear-based beliefs that have been handed down and rebuilt to encompass the harsh nature of reality, the energy of misinterpretation only increases. Here we have race, we have money, we have morality, and we have gods...all coming together in a firestorm of angst, social change, rapid change, high stress and threat.
Our mind can either open to that, and learn its way through, or it can refuse to budge, and like Lot's wife as Sodom and Gomorrah burned, stand looking at the imagined past, the filtered memory, and stay frozen, too afraid to turn and embrace the future.
Look around the world. There are hundreds of millions of people refusing the future. Taliban, Orthodox Jews, Amish, Hindi nationalists, Islamic fundamentalists, Christian fundamentalists, conspiracy theorists everywhere...and millions who struggle alone in their own personal bubble of refusal. Having a god on one's side makes it the easiest because one can stand amongst one's flock and argue that a 'god made me do it!' while refusing the change that time imposes. God's also give great comfort to believing another is so different that they are less valued than oneself, which is why gods are always on 'our side' as we slaughter the others.
One can only continue to be ever vigilant for the fears in one's self, and the blinding that it entails, because fear by its nature believes in its interpretations. Psychological fear ends in an instant when the mind sees through its beliefs. But it has to want to look through...otherwise, all interpretation builds reinforces and supports our fear.
At the same time, such fear has real danger. Rwanda is such fear unleashed, laid on top of simmering social imbalance. Taliban and Al Quaeda mobilize young people through giving such fear a form and a target for relief. It all seems so legitimate at first...to be intertwined with those who too see how awful everything is...out there. The KKK and similar militias in the US seem such the right thing to these people trying to live in a period in their minds that is gone.
So it's important to always return to the invitation to those so afraid to come out and break bread, and share story, and find shared perception and meanings. We do ourselves no good by fearing one another, except we build up the wild-eyed portfolio of accusations, labels and deep misrepresentations of one another to further justify our fear. The fear helps us justify our social distance from those different than ourselves as we reduce one another to stereotypes and images...all the while we each are simply human beings trying to eek out a living, and get through the journey as best we can.
In fear, we can't see our similarity, but rather, we exalt our differences...which are far smaller in number and consequence than our similarity.
In fear, we can't hear dialogue. We can either hear the drumbeat of our heart racing in our uncertainty, or we hear the monologue of our flocks' leaders as they exhort us to see one more chimera of our dis-ease. We touch our heads to the floor in supplication before the idols of our misinterpretation.
The question before us always is...how do we quiet our minds, our hearts, long enough to listen, instead of scream? How do we see the person in front of us, instead of the devil we drew in crayons that hangs on our refrigerator door, and of which we are sooooo proud?
We're seduced by our crayon-devils. They are so much easier for us to wrap our broken minds around than are the real people who are our real neighbors.
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cbond35
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Sep 4 @ 8:39AM
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<----Responsible for 9/11
I blew up the Twin Towers with Chinese firecrackers and Cheeze Whiz.
How's that for a conspiracy?
(Before anyone pipes up, "You shouldn't make light of 9/11!" - You should note that I lost 2 Naval buddies that day and gave up 6 years of my life defending our beautiful country. So, I can say whatever the f*ck I want.)
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eastham
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Sep 4 @ 10:03AM
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Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem.
Translated, "entities must not be multiplied beyond necessity."
Several years ago, the Pew Trust began assessing the public's understanding of key domestic and international news events as linked to the media outlets they watched. Not surprisingly, individuals with multiple sources of news information scored much higher than those whose news sources were limited to one television network or one newspaper. Individuals who confessed they did not read a newspaper or watch the evening news on a regular basis outscored individuals who get all of their news from Fox. I can only imagine how the advent of news via YouTube videos will affect people's scores. Hmm.
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Nightowl001
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Sep 4 @ 10:07AM
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"News via YouTube" is about as accurate as sex education on a grade-school playground.
After Observed's eloquence, I can hardly add anything else. (Too bad I can't kudo a comment, in addition to the blog.)
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LipGlossQueen9
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Sep 4 @ 10:12AM
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Where are the rational conservatives, skeptical of the rantings of paranoid fringers?
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Kentuck
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Sep 4 @ 11:43AM
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Politicts and the programming of the WEAK minds of the American people. It is unfortunately that most Americans can read and write; however, they have a problem of understanding and retaining what they have read. Then there are the others who depend on theTV commentators and Blog peope for information. You would be surprised to know the number of people who do not know the difference between the Constitution and the Decelaration of Independence. Also to know that the first 10 ammendements of the constitution cannot be changed or ammended--they stand as they are.
With this president we have entered into a new zone or erra. One where not only the die hard political people are out in number spreading false information, but bioggets and racist.
Just look at what this contry has come to:
Araizona Preacher praying that Obama and his family die.--racism
People carrying guns to town meetings.
there is an old military statement---This is my weapon, it is for killing--This is my gun, it is for fun. You see people kill, weapons do the work.
Then there is the so called news media--Fox a direct outlet of the Republican party.
Nancy Grace and her California Bitches
All these so called experts--just loud mouths that represent a political party and seek to spread lies.
Health care--I think everyone needs it--even the poor. If you check history you will find that the plauge starts in the slums and mutates and spreds to the general public. Now if you do not believe this--just think about where the Bird flu and the Swine flu started and they expect that 100,000 Americans will die this year and over 2 million will be hospitilazed.--As they say with a snake--kill it by chopping its head off--so stop the diease where it starts and grows.
Otherwise; will you be one of the 2 million or the 100,000. For diease has not preference as to it attacks.
So, check your source of information--this site is full of false people
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musicianfriend
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Sep 4 @ 1:00PM
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Just goes to show you, you have no tolerance for any man who is rational enough to disagree with you... (Granted, any rational man would grow weary of the paranoid rants within minutes...)
Rational man? Surely you jest!
I have tolerance...Ive done this with you for months...but now....you have ran off my conservative friends..and 10 to 1 is getting tireing...
Most of all Napa...Im tired of your personal attacks..instead of addressing what the thread is about..
I feel like Im in kindergarten with a name calling fight..
This is exactly why Popo and a few others left...they told me so...
So...until there are more rational people in the threads...with better opposition ..Im divorcing you...lmao
I like the thrill of debate...as we both can learn from the exchange of information...but you and your little thread whores gang up on me...calling me names like little kindergarteners..
Frankly...its stupid..and Im not playing that game...
I may start a thread or post...BUT I REFUSE to banter with the name calling and childish crap anymore...I will just ignore your insults..
Popo did this for awhile..but he finally just left...So did Damsel....Gemini...Web Monster..and many more...
Perhaps because we are older than you...we deem this type of exchange..childish and inmature..
I try to reason withyou.. and get you back on track..but you people are like stubborn mules...and theres no hope for you...to keep you on track..in an intellegent conversation.
you criticize my 'conspiracy therories..'
So then...when does the conspiracy become a reality....The 'conspiracies' are now realities...they are happening...
The leaders are on videos everywhere talking about their New World Order..and yet...your cement encased brain doesnt get it...Cause its to scarey for you to digest..
What ever...doesnt matter to me...Im not going to bother with you anymore...
Were divorced. If you post crap...I intend to ignore you..Not that I wont take a swipe at your intellegence on occasion..to set the thread straight..
Everything I say cant always be wrong...as you and your thread whores always imply..According to you...and your buds..Im never right about anything..No one is always wrong....
When that happens...its because one is bantering with an inmature uninformed group of blind sheep...following the Judas Goat to their own slaughter...
You call me delusional etc....I say to you..your just uninformed....unwilling to truthfully vet your candidate..and his policies.....you would prefer to be on the Obama train cause it feels good..and perhaps you think you will get free money by supporting a communist..
I dont know...and now..i really dont care..
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eastham
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Sep 4 @ 1:15PM
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Perhaps because we are older than you...we deem this type of exchange..childish and inmature..
Madam, you have posted repeatedly to another's blog...not an open forum, but a blog...posting the same ranting and ravings you do in the threads.
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musicianfriend
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Sep 4 @ 1:29PM
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<----Responsible for 9/11
I blew up the Twin Towers with Chinese firecrackers and Cheeze Whiz.
How's that for a conspiracy?
I knew it all along...but was afraid to tell anyone...they wouldnt believe me anyway..
Sorry about your buddies...tragic is was what happened there...
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People carrying guns to town meetings.
I havent heard anything about anyone shooting their guns..
But I DID hear about that Obama supporter biting off the finger of an elderly gentleman...protesting for his right to life...
You people are so freaking ignorant..
I suggest that Obamaites not be allowed to come to protests with teeth...Because teeth dont bite...people do...
Your gun oppositiion makes about as much sense as my last comment on teeth..
Good people dont run around killing people...thats just more liberal spew...stupidity..
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Then there is the so called news media--Fox a direct outlet of the Republican party.
Nancy Grace and her California Bitches
All these so called experts--just loud mouths that represent a political party and seek to spread lies.
Obviously you know nothing about the Gov. Tv. stations that spew lies constatly..
And there is also the Obama side...the people who hav lied and lied and lied about everything...What about those liars...
Global Warming thats a hoax....trying to take away our rights on a freaking daily basis...Lies about the Healthcare bill...
Who do you deem we beleive....the people who have been lying to us all along? I think not...
NBC......NATIONAL BARRACK CHANNEL
CBS.....CENTRAL BARRACK SERVICE
ABC.....AMERICAN BARRACK CHANNEL
These stations lie out their azzes on a daily basis... I have known this since the Oliver North trial of tthe 80's...I watched it every single day...and when I watched the news of these three stations I mentioned...they distorted the truth....aired half sentences to change the meaning of what Oliver North was saying..
Perhaps it is you sir...thats not so smart as to the disinformation going on here...
Its been known that the 'conspiritors' have control over the media..and have channeled thought in America for decades....the truth is not important to liberals..
Just look at that story from the LA Times about the man who got his finger bit off..They blantantly lied and said it was the elderly man attacking the liberal..but that was a freaking lie.
I dont trust liars..once you lie to me..your done...Obama lied about Global Warming and tried to tax us to death over a lie...a hoax...
Tell me this genius...How come during the election ...Obama couldnt even fart wrong...yet they attacked everything the Republicans did?
Is that fair and balanced? You bias is so obvious..
Health care--I think everyone needs it--even the poor. If you check history you will find that the plauge starts in the slums and mutates and spreds to the general public. Now if you do not believe this--just think about where the Bird flu and the Swine flu started and they expect that 100,000 Americans will die this year and over 2 million will be hospitilazed.--As they say with a snake--kill it by chopping its head off--so stop the diease where it starts and grows.
Otherwise; will you be one of the 2 million or the 100,000. For diease has not preference as to it attacks.
So, check your source of information--this site is full of false people
I know 4 people diagnosed with the swine flu....there are alive and well...just fine...Its just a flu...and the gov is using a Rahm Emanual Crisis mode to get people to infect theirselves with this virus..No thank you...Its a scam...If Austria can ship kilos of live virus heading to be made into vaccines...I want no part of this crap..
If you still trust him..your just another sheeple...hanging on to the FALSE PROMISES of hope and change....
Yes..theres hope and change..but its not good for people like me...hes not talking to Americans like me...
Thats pretty evident by the protests..
And whats up with all the nazis and commies he has in his administration..
Dont tell me you didnt notice...cause its pretty freaking obvious..this mans up to no good...
Many people are reporting the truth about Obama and his lies...such as Hannity...Using ONLY the records of Obamas actual life..and still you call Fox the liar...?
Hannity and many many others are using truth to show you who paid for Obamas Harvard education...It was a man named Abdullah Al-Monsour...look it up yourself..this man is associated with terrorists...Black Nationalists which are communists...the same people Obamas Rev Wright is affiliated with..
And yet...the libs still dont get it..
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musicianfriend
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Sep 4 @ 1:30PM
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Its like watching sheep being led to a slaughter...Its like watching the Stepford wives...Brainwashed people..still clinging to false hope...Foolish people following the Judas Goat...
Do you know what that is? Thats Obama..and you are the sheep..being led to your own slaughter..
Because you do not know history..and are unwilling to investigate ALL truths..not just your liberal lies...
Your taking us all down with you...thus my anger..Many of us will have to suffer for your mistakes.. many people will die...because of your cult like loyalty to a bunch of commies who lie, cheat and steal...(redistribution of wealth)
Be very carefull..because after the wealth is taken from people...they have nothing left to loose..and this country is going to be a mess....All caused by the false Messiah/
I RESENT HIM PROPAGANDIZING OUR CHILDREN WITH HIS SCHOOL ADDRESS...HES A SICK MAN...JUST LIKE SADDAM HUSSEIN...HITLER..STALIN...BRAINWASHING THE PEOPLE..
Think for youself..quit being such a bunch of sheep..
The truth is there in front of your nose..and yet..you still cling to this mania...of false hope..
When he talks of Hope and Change..hes not talking to me or people like me..but only to communists...embedded into our society..
If not..then why so many commies in his administration?
Answer that for me dude...
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How do you explain the many kilos of LIVE BIRD FLU virus heading to be made into vaccinations....out of Austira...
There is a lawsuit against them now...Against the World Health Orgn......Obama...Napolitano...and others....
Why these particular people? Especially Obama...I dont trust anything these people are doing...
You just dont ship live virus by accident..If you beleive that its an accident..your a fool..
These people want to depopulate the earth..its in all of their writtings..If you dont know this..your ignorant..
Are you just another mindless government shill?
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eastham
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Sep 4 @ 2:13PM
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"News via YouTube" is about as accurate as sex education on a grade-school playground.
My money's on the playground sex ed class being more accurate.
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SweetNapaGuy
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Sep 4 @ 3:10PM
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Gotta be one of the shortest "divorces" in history... 
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