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Did Indians even have shields?

posted 10/10/2009 10:01:24 AM |

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thenewguy295

I'm watching this western on AMC right now starring Richard Widmark as a 'white' Commance. So he's fighting an Apache and suddenly it looks like a gladiator movie as he's whipping around a chain and the Apache is fending it off with a little round shield. So I'm wondering, did Indians even use shields? I would think it would have been an encumberance to the type of warfare they engaged in and useless for hunting and once firearms came along it would have been useless against bullets.
Does anybody know, did they even use shields or is this another Hollywood contrivance?

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jcarolina	Oct 10 @ 10:18AM
	They used shields for battle and for spiritual protection. They attached serious meaning and importance to their shields, and believed the shields had supernatural power.

observed50	Oct 10 @ 10:29AM
	Before bullets, much of Native conflict was face-to-face, horseback or not (remember that horses were introduced late in their presence on this continent). 'Counting coup' was about being able, in part, to touch another warrior, while cutting the braid was a symbol of lost power, shame. The shield helped fend off the face-to-face attacker from getting close enough to touch, to knife, to cut the braid. If he's using a chain...that might be one of the later Native groupings called 'gangs.' Widmark might have walked in on a tribe touched by a time traveler??

thenewguy295	Oct 10 @ 10:34AM
	'Counting coup' was about being able, in part, to touch another warrior, while cutting the braid was a symbol of lost power, shame. The shield helped fend off the face-to-face attacker from getting close I was thinking that a shield might have been seen as cowardly when counting coup, that's why I wondered if they even used them. Thanks for the comments.

Kentuck	Oct 10 @ 10:37AM
	you are seeing the fogging of history--hollywood. But they did have shields made of tough leather. more so of the western indian and the buffalo hide. I was watching the same movie--that was all written by a white man for a white man audience. so sorry--but that is life. Most westerns are like that. They still have not made a movie to really show General Custard 's last stand.

thenewguy295	Oct 10 @ 10:43AM
	you are seeing the fogging of history--hollywood. Lol, quite true. If you remember the movie Braveheart Wallace's big victory at Sterling Bridge has no bridge in the film, though the bridge was key to the real battle.

tbull38	Oct 10 @ 12:40PM
	Sheilds were very common and very important. Most had paintings or symbols. Some were just for spititual medicine. Hand to hand combat was the way they fought most of thier battless so a sheild could mean the difference between life or death. Hollywood uses indians as a prop for lousy movies. Have you ever seen one shot kill two Indians off of two horses. Hmm

Hooks	Oct 10 @ 1:29PM
	It's funny, and sometimes even sad, what they do in those western flicks. They would pick certain things from their culture to lend a little authenticity, but much was just making a movie. Like you always see when the Indians come up to talk with the general or something they say "How" as a greeting. It sounds the same but what they are actually saying is "Hao" which is still used in Mandarin Chinese, as well as other Asian cultures. Basically it means hello, as does saying ni hao, or ni hao ma which is saying hello how are you. Yep we originally came from Asia, so we were not just a bunch of blood thirsty savages like in the movies!

legacy1	Oct 10 @ 2:46PM
	You got love Hollywood...remember the movie 300? Instead of having breast plates etc to protect their vital organs they instead were ripped like any bodybuilder in which they could use said muscles to deflect arrows and the swing of the sword!

Josuha	Oct 10 @ 6:02PM
	Depending on the people, shields were made from rawhide and willow (able to bend it) and laced on. As with bows, when horses arrived in North America, the shields got smaller to manuver on horseback. There are also some European shields that are covered in rawhide when the crossbow was developed when took the impact better than raw wood. There is evidence that Norse shields were covered on the edge with rawhide. Most shields were throw away affairs and after a battle or two were to damaged to be of any use. The parts were used in another shield. As a matter of trivia, Norse shields as well as other shields were not just painted for decoration. It was to hide the grain of the wood so an opponent could not strike a blow in a vulnerable area and split it or disable it. The same holds true with some native American shields where they were bound with rawhide or sinue. I make Norse shields and middle ages ashields for reenactoments. They wll take the impact of a battle axe. The native American shields however would shred with the same weapon. As Paul Harvey used to say..Now you know...the rest of the story. Reeneactment http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5zNK--DUDg

SpiritOrnery	Oct 29 @ 5:44PM
	Oh, definitely, they had shields but chains? No way.

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