Hello once again. I have another axe to grind.
In film and Television, Al Gore quoted the fact that in the next 20 years (this was in the year 2000 as he was running for president) the mean ocean temperature would rise by over 1.2 degrees Farenheit. The effect of this would cause mass stonytcoral bleaching and the total destruction of our coral reefs. He also intimated that this was already happening (or maybe you were watching a different documentary to the one that I was watching).
Now, I ask you - did you hear or read something like this?
But you see, I have a problem with this. It does not add up. The mean tropical ocean temperatures stay around 76 degrees Farenheit. It is a pretty stable temperature. OK, a rock pool tends to heat up midday in the hot sun...but the oceans' currents and cooler water welling up from the deep tend to keep the reefs of our world at a pretty constant temperature, right?
It is good so. But what if we tested this theory out to the extreme? What if we trashed the 1.2 degrees temperature change and subjected, say, 25 species of Stony Reef Building corals to an extreme of ten times those parameters? Or. say, prolonged temperature differences of between 72 and 88 degrees F? And when I say prolonged, I mean for a couple of years!
Well....I did just that. In the process I found that the fecundity of my stony, reef building coral charges actually incresaed! You see I am a marine biologist and a researcher into these things. At the moment I have many examples of 26 different species of baby corals growing in tanks in my living room and hallway at wildlyu fluctuating temperature extremes. Anyone who has a saltwater aqaurium can contact me. I'll send you some of my 'baby corals' if you pay the freight.
But as far as Al Gore goes................Oh Dear! I just ruined your day.
Copy & paste to friend: (Click inside box; Ctrl + C to copy; Ctrl + V to paste)
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read more blogs!
Blogs by LuckyDragon:
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| You know, I still can't get over this Al Gore film |
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bardnsage
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Nov 19 @ 11:30PM
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YOU SIR ARE A RADICAL NAZI EARTH HATING EVIL DOER. CAPTAIN PLANET WILL MAKE YOU PAY. IF NOT HIM, THEN THE OBAMANATOR WILL BE YOUR UNDOING.
Imagine,,, using something as ludicrous as knowledge of marine biology, and scientific method to test a theory,,, rather than just to substantiate your next grant to study global warming.
All kidding aside,,, you sir have stumbled into the Gobal Climate Quaqmire. There is so much anecdotal bullshit, to support a political position, that any real science pro or con, is lost in the flood of hype and envionmental activism.
The average person,, is just sick of it. And the response,, screw the polar bears, I want cheap gas and a job.
I'm still looking on the ground everywhere, trying to find those foam boxes that hamburgers used to come in, that were going to last for a century. They make good fire starters.
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lovestobake
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Nov 20 @ 12:06AM
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Kudo to you!
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SpiritOrnery
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Nov 20 @ 12:29AM
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Actually, I just read an article about the huge jellyfish that are growing and reproducing wildly. They are threatening Japan's fishing industry. It is said that the temperatures have already grown like they said it would and that and the dumping of effluence (wastes) by China in the sea is making huge blooms of plankton that attracts these deadly giant jellyfish. They are all hanging out there because the water is now warmer so they can.
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LuckyDragon
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Nov 20 @ 1:30AM
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Wow, SpiritOrnery! That is a sweeping statement you have just made. Giant jellyfish huh? Since you are talking about the South China Sea, I assume to the species you are talking about is Cyanea capillata, a species with a bell diameter well in excess of 40 inches.
Problem is, your use of the word 'effluence'. You see there are two types of effluence. One is chemical, usually poisonous to all marine life including Scyphozoans (Jellyfish). The other form of effluence is protein based (pee and poo from open sewers and other organic waste). But this kind will never increase or cause sporadic blooming of marine zooplankton Sorry, that is impossible.
In fact, it will erupt in the form of organophosphates and nitrate in the water. Plankton does not like this. Neither do Jellyfish. Certainly an abundance of these compounds NO3 & PO-4 would kill most marine life including the various life forms that make up zooplankton.
So let's get back to basics. Nitrates and phosphates are excellent plant foods. In excess, they produce algal blooms (marine plants). But so far as I am aware as a marine biologist, jellyfish do not feed on plants............unless, of course, you know of a new species that does. In fact Jellyfish are active preditors. Large specimens feed on fishes, but sometimes they use their vellum (the bell) to capture zooplankton before transferring it to the oral cavity. But that is not plant based (phyotoplankton, which is the only conceivable byproduct of your 'effluence')
So please tell me on which paper you are basing your theory. I'd like to read this remarkable revelation!
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shyflygemini
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Nov 20 @ 1:44AM
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I'd just like to know why you have 2 different user names on his site, same picture and two different California cities you live in. I think you should remove one, but I would bet after reading your blog you'll be of the opinion to say mind my own business. Ah well, no matter, I just find it scammy to have 2 profiles.
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LuckyDragon
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Nov 20 @ 2:32AM
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Yes, well ShyflyGemini, I do not know how to answer this correctly. But I'll try to be perfectly honest. You are right - I do have two profiles and they are in different cities. But in real life people tend to move around when they are single. And right now I am living in South Carolina - not California. So should I create a third profile???
Thing is, some friends on this web site know me by my profile name. They are REAL FRIENDS and I really appreciate them. So I keep the profiles more or less active so they know I am there for them when they need or want me.
If you cannot handle this kind of friendship and loyalty 'Shame on you".
I could have trashed both my old profiles with a click of a mouse. I chose not to - so sue me. But perhaps I should sue you for intimating that I am a scammer!
I make no secret of my identity. It is Dr. Vincent B. Hargreaves. Google me, you silly female. Most folks, and I mean the true people on here, know me as an honest and serious person.
But they also know my preferences in companionship of the female gender too.
Slender does not mean full figured, voluptuous, curvy, big and beautiful, few extra pounds, average or whatever. It means simply slender.
One more thing, your comment was not a blog on my original train of thought. In fact it was an attempt to attack my credibilty through my two somewhat old profiles.
Well sorry dearie, you appear to have some serious issues. I, thank God, do not.
Kind regards,
Vincent
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SpiritOrnery
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Nov 20 @ 3:13AM
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http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/climate_09_jellyfish_menace
Here is the link. Yes, it is yahoo and they are notorious for their amazing inaccuracies but take it how they wrote it and like I said...the plankton is being fed by the SEWAGE or effluence and the jellies are attracted to the over growth of plankton according to the article.
Oh, most people when they move merely change their home address on their profiles. No need to make a new profile. 
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dizzydoll
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Nov 20 @ 5:17AM
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I just read an article about the huge jellyfish that are growing and reproducing wildly.
this is because they are killing sharks, dophins and whales, let them deal with the jellyfish as we will have to do when humans eventually kill our animals - rats and cockroaches will live on. Something for your kids to look forward to.
There is a saying, something in the lines of: "Whatever the masses follow you can be sure that its wrong". Of course I dont expect humans to believe they have lost all humanity... its easier to live in denial 
We are a dumb lot, movies aside positive changes will be made in Copenhagen, irrespective of what the masses say. Why? Its is my globe as much as it is yours 
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dizzydoll
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Nov 20 @ 5:25AM
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Google me, you silly female.
That was unnecessary and sexist Vincent. Even if I chose to have two different profiles, which I dont, I certainly wouldnt make them contradict each other. 
I think ShyflyGemini is right to be cautious in cyberspace. 
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dizzydoll
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Nov 20 @ 5:32AM
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One more thing, how do we know you really are:
Dr. Vincent B. Hargreaves
And even if you are, why is it important to keep bringing it up?
We are here to interact with each other and discover things for ourselves, I always feel perplexed when someone attempt to force information down my throat especially when they use terms like "I am honest"
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masonfun52
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Nov 20 @ 6:43AM
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I'd just like to know why you have 2 different user names on his site One more thing, how do we know you really are: Dr. Vincent B. Hargreaves What does it matter??? That has nothing to do with the issue he blogged about. How does anyone really know anything about anyone here? A person could list themselves as being in the Virgin Islands when they're really somewhere else.
Sheesh . . . why do some women have to be so nit-picky???
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AverageJoe
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Nov 20 @ 9:02AM
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As another blogger said in the past "Al Gorstradamus" has not been very good predicting future events. The king of hypocrisy preaches to us about saving the environment. And at the same time lives in a mansion that uses 12 times as much energy as an average home.
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Borty
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Nov 20 @ 9:03AM
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I'm Professor Pan.T.Borty ...Of the famous Bort's Panty Emporuim... 
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ttomtarr
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Nov 20 @ 9:19AM
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Corals, and most marine organisms, do not live in "mean ocean temperature water". They live in the huge flowing rivers, stagnant ponds, vortexes, and quiet lakes that exist in the ocean, just like on the land.
A great temperature change in one part that bathes the corals can have a small affect on "mean temperature", or be altogether lost in an opossite, larger thermal shift.
Here on the Gulf of Mexico, we have fresh water springs in the salt water, which are often a different temperature than the surrounding water, and often have very different types and quantities of marine life in their area.
Masssive agal blooms can be more efficiant than fish at oxygen metabolism, producing lots of it during sunlit hours, but using up so much oxygen at night that the fishs die for lack of it. Lake Erie was a good example of this. So that, in general terms, liquid runoff from the land definately can result in the death of some species of marine life taken as an entire process..
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RareQuestor
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Nov 20 @ 9:45AM
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Just a few questions for you to chew on, sir.
Did it occur to you that your salt water aquariums are a controlled environment?
Are your aquariums as biologically diverse as the ocean is?
Do you plan to submit the results of your so-called experiment to a scientific journal for review and publication? If so, might we ask what steps you took to eliminate bias from your experiment and what controls you used?
Are you prepared to challenge the data and conclusions of your fellow marine biologists? (Note that Al Gore is not a marine biologist.)
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dizzydoll
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Nov 20 @ 10:08AM
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KILL IT, KILL IT, THE SOONER THE BETTER
I'm Professor Pan.T.Borty ...Of the famous Bort's Panty Emporuim
I can vouch for Prof. Borty, he is a man of integrity and a man of his word.
Watch that clip guys... it will open your eyes
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cbond35
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Nov 20 @ 10:12AM
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But perhaps I should sue you for intimating that I am a scammer!
That is the funniest thing I have heard in a long time..."I'm gonna sue you because you called me scammy online!".....Good luck with that lawsuit "doctor".
Google me, you silly female.
Good luck finding a match as well, "doctor".
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moon_watcher53
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Nov 20 @ 10:54AM
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Hey Vince, glad to see you changed your settings and I don't have to "wait for approval" !!
Kinda makes you one of us now !! Doesn't it feel really good ??
I hope you'll explain El Nino in your next blog !!
Seems as though the temps of westen South American waters get so high it kills the fish as far out as 80 miles (128.747 kilometers) !!
Makes me wonder if thats the reason I've been having to pay higher prices for a can of Sardines !!
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LuckyDragon
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Nov 20 @ 1:07PM
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RareQuestor,
I appreciate your questions and comments. I have 'chewed' on them.
In any marine research is is important to have a controlled environment otherwise the fidings would be meaningless.
The biodiversity of my test tanks is as near to the natural environment as is technologically possible. Live aragonite based sand, live rock, etc.
Yes, I plan to publish my findings as I always do. Peer reviewing and challenges are always welcome. I know that Al Gore is not a marine scientist.
It is impossible to eliminate bias in an experment of this nature, but I have done my best. For instance, two Azure damselfish decided to breed and lay eggs on two of the experimental aragonite coral plugs. I had to let it happen and ignore it. The eggs hatched and the resulting larvae were eaten by other marine life. In fact the pair of damselfish lay eggs about every three weeks. Always on the same plugs. To remove the plugs and the eggs to a separate rearing tank would have introduced a bias and compromised the whole thing.
I hope this answers your questions.
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RareQuestor
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Nov 20 @ 3:45PM
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Thank you for the answers, LuckyDragon.
It just seemed fairly obvious that the ocean is not a controlled environment and may produce different results. I do not dismiss your research entirely; I just wondered whether you were making the classic error of approaching a complex problem from a limited perspective. We both know that integrating data from multiple sources is an extremely complex challenge.
As a member of the Coral Reef Alliance, I applaud your efforts to help solve some of the problems that we confront and ensure that future generations will be able to enjoy the beauty and marvels of coral reefs. 
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bardnsage
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Nov 20 @ 10:59PM
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It just seemed fairly obvious that the ocean is not a controlled environment and may produce different results. I do not dismiss your research entirely; I just wondered whether you were making the classic error of approaching a complex problem from a limited perspective.
It just seemed fairly obvious that the ocean is not a controlled environment and may produce different results. So by measuring water temp and noting that many species of coral are in jepordy in the ocean,,, may result in a positive correlation, but it in no way shows causality.
By performing the experiments in a controlled environment, other variables are eliminated from the study.
Once you have eleminated all the variables and tested all the single factors, then you analyize the data and begin to form experiments based on possible combined effects. Then you design your experiment to isolate the combined effect, eliminate other variables,,, etc. etc. etc.
The jump from correlation to causation, is the real "Classic Error" of most environmental science being tossed around in the media and in the high profile grant circles,,,,, pro and con.
The goal is not the science,,, the goal is continued funding.
And there is a high "correlation" between a scientist or reaserch group's funding,,, and the "conclusions" they publish.
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eyesofastranger
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Nov 21 @ 6:36AM
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I was asked to post my comments from a thread here
How did 2012 and climate change get linked? Mother Earth is an organism in trouble and nature will change to deal with the excess CO2. And this change will be dire for the humans of Earth. If you plan on being around in 2050 you can check it out. CO2 emissions are ever increasing, Rain and arboreal forests are everr shrinking. Peat and coal is being mined increasingly. CO2 is being cooked out of portland to make cement at ever increasing numbers. The oceans are displaying acidic zones and coral bleaching. The ability of the ocean to absorb CO2 and take it depths is reaching saturation.
So I suppose it's like the sinking ship scenario where most won't take the unfamiliar life boat until it's too late. Everyone with an education higher than grade 6 knows the ship is sinking and this is unsustainable. But the eventual consequence is too dramatic to think about so they search for someone to tell them the ship will probably only sink half way or any minute now the bilge pumps will kick in.
It's clear that our current eco system can sustain each of us producing 6000lbs of CO2 a year. And in north america we produce 20,000lbs.
But all this has nothing to do with 2012 unless Earth has a plan to sterilize the organism causing the problem sooner rather than by the natural process thats coming.
I have kept marine aquariums with corals and live rock and have studied the nitro cycle and can convey that in a closed system there is little or no effect from temperature. Cooling systems are extremely expensive and inefficient so I have never considered them during heat waves that see 34c every day.
I suppose biologists never study the duration of the ocean currents and the cycle of oxygen CO2.
If you contend that this human discourse is sustainable I suggest you sit on your front porch for an hour with a six pack and consider the human psyche then follow your thoughts to conclusion.
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RareQuestor
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Nov 21 @ 9:26AM
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The goal is not the science,,, the goal is continued funding.
And there is a high "correlation" between a scientist or reaserch group's funding,,, and the "conclusions" they publish.
It must be sad and terrifying to live in a world where no one does anything except for profit. 
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bardnsage
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Nov 23 @ 1:52AM
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Well damn RQ,,, are you saying it is not that way?
Not only is it basic human nature, but it's the pattern I've seen. After observing, partcipating in, and evaluating "scientific" research done under a federal grant,,, the correlations are high that a group will find and publish what they need to continue funding.
Barf all you want,,, but it's the world you live in too.
In one of the forums, you posted a nice long list of "Climate" scientists, who all had reserach to support man made global warming. Nice,, now if there is no global warming,,, how hard is it for them to lock up the next grant. If you are funded by the Sieara Club,,, and you come back and tell them they are full of shit, you are out of a job.
In the same forum,, someone else posted a long list of "researchers" who were debunking man made global warming. There funding,, was from oil compaines, etc.,,, and you were quick (rightly so) to point out that their "conclusions" could be biased by their funding source.
How come only those who debunk man made global warming are capable of the bias in your barf free world?
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LuckyDragon
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Nov 24 @ 2:12AM
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OK, the level of discourse on the subject that I raised is getting quite heated. I did not intend that. I merely mentioned my observations and uneasiness about a subject in my realm of the marine sciences that was being used for political advantage. I wanted to express the fact that not all scientists are biased by funding, and therefore follow their paymasters.
I set up my experiments with my own private funding. I do not get grants from anyone. And let's face it folks - it is not cheap. But I care enough to spend $100K or more to see the results of my research. And this is money from my own bank account and credit cards - yes! That too! Because I believe in what I am doing. You all may think you are doing a great job by donating to the WWF, and your donations do make a difference. But it is drops in the ocean compared to what I have tried to acheive. In 1981, I used the military manpower of the United Kingdom to create the first man made coral reef in the South China Sea. I did not get paid for it per se. OK, I earned a few bucks from articles and photos that I produced for magazine publication - but that was not 'funding' and did not even cover a small portion of my hotel bill.
I will remain unbiased and without funding - therefore my self-funded expertise trumps any political or party polemic.
And this is my last word on this. Please feel free to discuss this further. Sorry for my intervention at this point, but it had to be said.
I suggest you think hard before challenging me - because I will only listen if you can propose a better way forward than that which I have worked on for the last 40 years. Don't forget what this is all about. I grow baby reef building corals in my hallway and living room! Over 30 different healthy species.
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