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Some questions looking for intelligent simple answers

posted 9/7/2017 7:18:47 PM |
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The drama on the "dreamers" I would like some answers. I think American Citizens should come first in all benefits that we pay into. I also believe we need to take care of American citizens before sending money to other countries. If you are not an American citizen get yourself in gear and become one no excuses! Others sacrificed to do it quit expecting a free ride. There is no grey area your either legal or illegal.

1. Do they work and pay into Social Security?
2. Do they pay into Fed State and Local taxes?
3. Do they get first handouts when it comes to jobs or education before American Citizens? They are not American Citizens and therefore should have to step back.
4. Why are they not American Citizens?
5. Do they receive welfare, social security, or any other benefits?
6. Do they send their money back to their place they came from?.

These are just some of my questions but will help me in my outlook on this. Please no long answers. Don't care who got us in this or is going to get us out. America we have a problem and need solutions.

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Sep 7 @ 7:58PM  
As long as there is a single American who isn't living THEIR dreams, there is no place for a freeloaders dreams.

The benefits these illegals receive depends on what state they live in. In ALL states American taxpayers are forced to pay for their education, free medical care, police protection, the legal services and court time they take up and all the other free services government provides for them. This alone costs TENS OF BILLIONS OF DOLLARS. Some states, I don't know how many, give them various welfare benefits as well. Some of that is up to the state.

If they work (legally) they pay into the tax system. But even if they don't, they still get the free benefits.

One of the worst things about our immigration policy is that if you are born here you are automatically a citizen. No other country in the world does this. It's CRAZY! There is a whole industry of hospitals and tour companies that are hired by foreign women to come here to drop their babies just so they can automatically become citizens. It's NUTS! This HAS TO BE STOPPED.

But the rub is that the Constitution would have to be changed to do it. That is nearly impossible to do in the current political environment in this country.

Sep 7 @ 7:58PM  

Sep 7 @ 8:04PM  
Also worth mentioning. Some colleges give PREFERENCE to illegals. That's right PREFERENCE.

That means that some Americans are not getting into the college of their choice or maybe any college at all because an ILLEGAL "DREAMER" === STOLE THEIR DREAM ===

Sep 7 @ 9:00PM  
I see it this way...

They had no choice in the matter. Some didn't even know they were illegal until they applied for a license or job. Some are in our military fighting for our cause. They don't know any other place then here. Their are some that don't even speak Spanish.

When Trump was running for office he said ... He wouldn't do anything to them because it would be heartless to remove people that have been here for like 25 years... That didn't know anything else.

Guess he changed his mind.

I don't understand why they aren't being given the chance to become a citizen?

If they are a productive member of society... I think they should be given a chance!

Sep 7 @ 9:29PM  
The dreamers are now 20 to 30 years old....they had plenty of time to be the daMN paperwork. Cross your t's and dot your i's. My great grandmother's went thru Ellis Island and stand in line. Why can't the dreamers?

Sep 7 @ 10:00PM  
Let's set the record straight here on what President Trump did because the liberal media is lying about it and too many people don't understand it.

What President Trump did is give 6 months notice that he was going to rescind Obama's ILLEGAL executive order granting amnesty to these 800,000 so called "Dreamers." No one even disputes that Obama's order was illegal. Not even OBAMA. He said publicly on numerous occasions that HE DOES NOT HAVE THE CONSTITUTIONAL LEGAL AUTHORITY TO GRANT THESE PEOPLE AMNESTY WITHOUT CONGRESS FIRST PASSING SUCH A LAW. He SAID THAT loud an clear... multiple times. The problem was that Congress rejected this amnesty. So then Obama acted ON HIS OWN, ILLEGALLY and created an ILLEGAL executive order DEFYING the will of Congress to grant them amnesty. He DEFIED the US Constitution according to his own admission.

Furthermore, Obama made it clear that his executive order WAS ONLY TEMPORARY and even after he signed it said that it was only good for a short time unless Congress acted to pass the law.

So Obama himself said it was only temporary. No one even disputes that. Temporary means it has an end. And President Trump said it is coming to an end in 6 months. He gave a 6 month grace period in order to give Congress time to either pass a law making these people legal or not. It's up to CONGRESS as the Constitution provides.

So what President Trump did is not only to fix the illegal things that Obama did and restore the rule of law, but at the same time he turned the decision of whether or not these people should be legalized over to the place where the Constitution says it must be decided... that being CONGRESS. And he gave them time to do it.

So you could say that President Obama has been EXTREMELY GENEROUS to these "dreamers." He could have told them get out of our country RIGHT NOW. And at the same time he is restoring law and order to the federal government.

That is the TRUTH about what happened that you never hear in the liberal press.

Finally, the entire protest by these illegals and the left is a scam. NONE OF THEM ARE GOING TO BE DEPORTED. President Trump will not deport them. It's all about the PRINCIPLE involved. And he is PRECISELY RIGHT. He MUST restore constitutional law an order in the federal government after it was TRASHED for 8 years by Obama. Without that we have no country.

What President Trump DID NOT DO is say that they have to be deported.

Sep 7 @ 10:10PM  
The president has no legal authority to decide he doesn't like the fact that Congress wouldn't create a law and then just decide to create that law himself. That violates one of the most basic foundations of our constitution and democracy, the separation of powers.

The president doesn't get to decide which laws he likes and which laws he doesn't and then ignore the laws he doesn't like. He has a constitutional DUTY to FAITHFULLY ENFORCE ALL LAWS whether he likes them or not. Congress passes the laws and the president enforces them. And the courts are the referees when there is a dispute. That is the BASIC FOUNDATION of our entire democracy.

So Obama HAD NO LEGAL AUTHORITY to ignore Congresses rejection of the law granting amnesty to "Dreamers." What he did was a VIOLATION of our democracy and President Trump is 1000% right to slap it down.

Sep 7 @ 10:38PM  
NONE OF THEM ARE GOING TO BE DEPORTED. President Trump will not deport them.

Where is that documented?

I would like to see that in writing...

Sep 7 @ 10:51PM  
A year from now you can come back and admit you were wrong. I'll accept your apology because I'm generous like that.

Sep 8 @ 2:15AM  
Give up DR. You've covered all the bases, explained it so even a child would understand it. Unfortunately some children never listen or learn. Liberals could care less about whether policy works or not, but just that it makes them FEEL morally superior about enacting it. Bottom line, they dont learn because they only are exposed to liberal clap trap. Liberals don't have opinions, only dogmatic talking points.

Sep 8 @ 3:46AM  
Really cocktail... You must find me very interesting to troll everything I write.

DR... I asked to see where that was written and you ask for an apology?

So I guess it's not actually documented anywhere... Right?

I've said this before... I'm not really into politics.
I just can't see people being ripped out of the only life they have ever known... To be sent some place they don't even remember. In their eyes... They are Americans.

You say that won't happen... Then great! I asked to see where it was written. Where can I read it for myself?

Oh and cocktail.... You know nothing about me. I don't care what you call it... I call it having a heart. I'm not trying to be morally superior over anyone... I just feel bad for them.

Sep 8 @ 9:51AM  
not all dreamers are middle aged...

the amnesty was to get them on the become citizens...NOT to allow them to continue being illegal..

and as they are illegal... the law says deportation is the only remedy as they broke the law to be here... and that is supposed to mean that they don't qualify.
unless given amnesty for that first illegal act....

DR is so wrapped up in the ( bad oobamma) hype and drama that he cannot see the solution that Obama solve this problem that he inherited...

and that trump has... totally f***ed it up to where there is no solution...

meanwhile cockman is...


just a dick...

I hear were felons and dui people cannot cross over into Canada even if it's just for a vacation...

so much for the innocent American....


Sep 8 @ 9:54AM  
Intelligent simple terms. Here they are.

The question on the table between President Trump and Congress is not whether the "dreamers" are going to be deported, but whether or not they will be allowed to have legal status to live here.

But the liberal media is LYING about it to try to gin up anger among ignorant liberals who don't understand anything and have a misplaced sense of self worth based on their warped idea of what compassion means.

There is no more reason to assume that President Trump intends to deport "dreamers" than any other invaders who are illegally in our country. As a matter of fact he has already made it clear that he is LESS likely to deport them than all the rest of the illegal invaders who are here that he has said he has no intention of deporting.

I want to clarify that I am not saying they SHOULD NOT be deported. I am only saying that they WON'T be deported.

Sep 8 @ 9:57AM  
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jump to: navigation, search

Colloquial name(s)
Introduced on
August 1, 2001
Sponsored by
Dick Durbin, Orrin Hatch
Legislative history
Introduced in the Senate as S. 1291 by Dick Durbin, and Orrin Hatch on August 1, 2001
The DREAM Act (acronym for Development, Relief, and Education for Alien Minors Act) is an American legislative proposal for a multi-phase process for qualifying alien minors in the United States that would first grant conditional residency and, upon meeting further qualifications, permanent residency.
The bill was first introduced in the Senate on August 1, 2001, S. 1291 by United States Senators Dick Durbin (D- Illinois) and Orrin Hatch (R- Utah), and has since been reintroduced several times (see legislative history) but has failed to pass.[1][2]

Contents  [hide] 
For conditional resident status
For permanent residency
Legislative history
Projections of economic impact
DREAM Act Activists
See also
External links

Beneficiaries of the DREAM Act must meet the following requirements:[3]
Not have entered the United States on a non-immigrant visa
Have proof of having arrived in the United States before age 16[4]
Have proof of residence in the United States for at least five consecutive years since their date of arrival
If male, have registered with the Selective Service
Be between the ages of 12 and 35 at the time of bill enactment
Have graduated from an American high school, obtained a GED, or been admitted to an institution of higher education
Be of good moral character[5]
During the first six years, qualifying people would be granted "conditional" status and would be required to (a) graduate from a two-year community college or (b) complete at least two years towards a four-year degree or (c) serve two years in the US military. After this six-year period, those who meet at least one of these three conditions would be eligible to apply for permanent resident status. During this six-year conditional period, they would not be eligible for federal higher education grants such as Pell grants but they would be able to apply for student loans and work study.[6]

Sep 8 @ 9:59AM  
and from that^^^^

DR spins and distorts to the max..

and we all know that trump waffles and lies every day he's awake..


Sep 8 @ 10:04AM  
On June 15, 2012, President Barack Obama announced that his administration would stop deporting illegal immigrants who match certain criteria included in the proposed DREAM Act.[37] On August 15, 2012, the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services (USCIS) began accepting applications

under the Obama administration's new Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals (DACA) program. Thousands applied for the new program.[38] Because DACA was designed in large measure to address the immigration status of the same people as the DREAM Act, the two programs are often debated together, with some making little distinction between them and others focusing on the difference between the DREAM Act's legislative approach in contrast to the implementation of DACA through executive action.[39]

As of January 2017, 740,000 people have registered through DACA.[40]

Dick Durbin (D-IL) recommended prompt passage of the DREAM Act in response to the Trump Administration's rescission of the 2012 DACA memorandum.[41

Sep 8 @ 10:14AM  
WTF does that mean?

The Dream Act that you posted FAILED. It was REJECTED by many times ... like SIX?... It never passed, it never became law.

It was rewritten, changed, adjusted, cut down, rearranged and shortened. IT STILL DIDN'T PASS. It was REJECTED.

That's the whole point. Congress, the representatives of the people, SOUNDLY AND REPEATEDLY REJECTED The Dream Act. I can't think of a single piece of legislation that has ever been more rejected by Congress than this.

Yet after the will of the people was made clear, and Congress exercised their constitutional power to prevent it from becoming law Obama had the GALL to violate the law, violate the democracy, ignore the will of the people, ignore the will of Congress and like a dictator in a third world country unilaterally decree that he was going to make it the law anyway. HE HAD NO LEGAL AUTHORITY TO DO SO. HE VIOLATED THE CONSTITUTION.

Yet, you and the other liberals think that is acceptable.

What you are supporting is known as ANARCHY. You are an anarchist. You don't believe in the rule of law, the foundation of America.

Sep 8 @ 10:27AM  

I know that...

the dream act is a good thing for America.. but politics kept it from passing..

I know that trump is using his power to undermine anything that Obama did by his powers..


trump is an idiot...

you are supporting an idiot...

that makes you one too...

the dream act was a done deal
and congress was happy...until trump used exactly the same power that created it.. to destroy it..

now.. the same battle to pass it in going to be the same conclusions..

the definition of insanity ....and all that rot...


Sep 8 @ 10:43AM  
the dream act was a done deal and congress was happy...until trump used exactly the same power that created it.. to destroy it..

What the hell are you smoking?

I just told you... THE DREAM ACT WAS NEVER PASSED INTO LAW. Congress REJECTED the Dream Act 6 times over about a 15 year period. That's what you call Congress being happy with it?

Are you on crack?

Sep 8 @ 10:46AM  
but it was... a presidential memorandum...

come on DR..

you are fighting a losing battle..

and your solution is to just..


if that was an illegal act... why did the same congress that could not pass it... embrace it?

trump ( and people like you..) is the only one who is dancing to his idiocracy....

Sep 8 @ 10:48AM  
It's not up to President Trump to determine the fate of the Dream Act. He has no more authority to continue it than Obama had to start in with it in the first place. And therefore he is not to blame for undoing Obama's illegal executive order.

The difference between President Trump and Obama is that President Trump refuses to violate the law, violate the Constitution, violate the will of the American people, violate the democracy and violate the will of Congress like Obama did.

The only people who are responsible for the failure of the Dream Act are in CONGRESS. So liberals are falsely accusing President Trump of something for over which he has no authority or legal ability to do. It's just one more of their phony scams to falsely attack President Trump.

Sep 8 @ 10:51AM  



means that you are a hypocrite...( as is trump)


Sep 8 @ 10:54AM  
but it was... a presidential memorandum...

FALSE! Obama had no legal authority or power to just grant immunity to these illegals. Just because he says so doesn't make it law. Just because he didn't like the fact that the law was not passed doesn't give him the authority to make up his own law. We don't have a King here. That is what the Revolution was fought over. It was a REJECTION of the notion that one man can make the law. And that is exactly what Obama TRIED to do. He violated the Constitution in doing so and dared take the law into his own hands.

Sep 8 @ 10:54AM  
DACA was accepted as law by a republican controlled congress and trump screwed the pooch by his actions...
creating chaos where there was none...

tha same congress screamed that Obamacare was bad... over and over..

but now embrace it as a workable solution..

get a clue DR..

trump is not qualified to be president...


Sep 8 @ 11:00AM  
Kathy... thank you for giving us this platform. I appreciate you providing me this forum where I ripped the liberal case to shreds and I hope you don't feel your blog was hijacked.

I think my work is done here so I will make this my last post.

Thanks again for the great blog. Wish I could give you another kudo

Sep 8 @ 11:04AM  
seems to me...

trump and his lawyers screamed that immigration was his sole responsibility and domain...and congress and the supreme court needed to just butt out..

while he changed the rules to suit himself...

and he got his ass handed to him by the courts...

the same courts that determined that DACA was legally sound...
and not a peep out of the republican controlled congress to say that Obama was reaching beyond his powers... (other than the usual political posturing's)

they were glad he did it....

to where this statement by you...

FALSE! Obama had no legal authority or power to just grant immunity to these illegals. Just because he says so doesn't make it law.

smacks of hypocrisy....


Sep 8 @ 11:11AM  
Magic Dave; what do ya say we break for a billion dollar lunch ?

Non magical Randy.} fine. But you're leaving the tip.

Sep 8 @ 11:16AM  
you left out....Robert...

and we can order as many 10,000 dollar bottles of wine that we can drink..

while the poor...

go hungry because ....

they are poor...

Sep 8 @ 2:12PM  
1. Do they work and pay into Social Security?
2. Do they pay into Fed State and Local taxes?
3. Do they get first handouts when it comes to jobs or education before American Citizens? They are not American Citizens and therefore should have to step back.
5. Do they receive welfare, social security, or any other benefits?

First off, it is unlawful to employ someone who is not eligible for employment. Employable people are citizens or people with a valid work visa. Those people have FedGov issued tax payer ID numbers, and are liable for income tax.

Some illegals work off book, thus pay no income taxes. The employer then can reduce the amount of payments she has to make for benefits like worker's comp and unemployment insurance, thus improving her bottom line.

Some illegals commit identity theft, and use someone else's tax payer ID. Normal withholding will apply in most of those cases (but not all).

ID theft is rather serious, since if they've stolen your ID to get employment, they're also using it to procure other services, such as medical treatment. If they're not actually filing returns, and the IRS comes looking for them, or if they get medical treatment and skip out on paying, the bill collector may look at the social security number and will find a victim of identity theft and demand payment.

State and local taxes is a yes/no/maybe answer. It depends on the tax: sales, gas and property taxes are hard to avoid, since they're collected at the point of sale. Some states and cities also collect income tax, so that is answered above.

As far as the hand outs go, they're also not eligible for them. Whether that's WIC or Section 8 housing, or welfare, if they're getting them they're committing fraud. They will probably find themselves aced out of any Social Security benefits, even if they did pay in. Worse for them if they do actually get any such payments, since that would be considered fraud.

Then there is the whole Earned Income Tax Credit (EITC) and an entire scam industry built around that. I suspect that most of the people who engage in that sell their EITC to scam artists for a mere pittance, while the scamsters rake in billions.

4. Why are they not American Citizens?
6. Do they send their money back to their place they came from?

Ask them. Maybe they just don't want to be citizens. It could be they are frightened that if they do get accepted into the immigration queue, then their shady past will come to light, and all those financial crimes will land them in the queue to be deported.

As for the last, some do, perhaps some don't. But external payments to Mexico has eclipsed the amount of money brought in by Pemex, the national oil and gas company. Something on the order of $25 billion.

Sep 8 @ 2:28PM  
Mostly true, the most important point being that most illegals do work "off the books" and therefore pay no federal or state income tax, social security tax, medicare tax or other payroll taxes. Of those who are "on the books" near 100% of them are so due to identity fraud of some nature since all employers are required by law to obtain a valid social security number and other ID information to ensure the person working has legal authority to do so.

But the one part that is fuzzier than you portrayed is access to "welfare." Some states take the position that it isn't clear cut that all illegals are exempt from all parts of a basket of so-called "welfare" benefits. And in some states they can and do in fact get some of these benefits "legally." I put legally in quotes because that's an arguable opinion. True they are not eligible for the major federal welfare programs, but at the state level it isn't as cut and dried.

See this for example.

Sorry... no time to fully research it but if you do I think you will find examples of actual "welfare" benefits willfully paid to illegals in some states.

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