This is not a blog for preaching to the masses, but just to answer a question that crops up sometimes. That question being "If you are going to live forever on Earth, then why does the Bible say that there are going to be a new heaven and a new earth and the old ones will be destroyed; doesn't that prove we are all going to heaven because the earth will be gone."
First of all, I should say this: If both heaven and earth were gone, the literal places having been destroyed, then it certainly would not prove that we would be resurrected to heaven: it would be gone!
However, if you mean by that you think we'd be resurrected to the new heaven, after the old one was destroyed, then how does that make any more sense than that we would be resurrected to the new earth, after the old one was destroyed?
As it is, though, I don't believe that whole scenario is even meant by what the Bible says. Why?
(2 Peter 3:13) 13 But there are new heavens and a new earth that we are awaiting according to his promise, and in these righteousness is to dwell.
(Isaiah 65:17) 17 “For here I am creating new heavens and a new earth; and the former things will not be called to mind, neither will they come up into the heart.
It seems to me that the newness being spoken of is related to the spirit, if you will, of the persons in heaven and earth. Or, perhaps it would be better to say it is about the living conditions and expectations; not the actual physical structure, but the social structure.
Think about it this way: when America became it's own country, it was a "new people" and a "new land" but it was still in the same location as when it belonged to England (primarily England). Right?
Copy & paste to friend: (Click inside box; Ctrl + C to copy; Ctrl + V to paste)
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read more blogs!
Blogs by HopelesslyHopeful:
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| New Heavens and a New Earth (explained) |
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 12:00PM
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God is going to remake everything after the rapture
all will be made new
the sinners will be in hell for eternity
and the saints will have a new life completely
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 12:11PM
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one thing that works for me is to not get too bogged down with the facts of eternity
if Jesus is your Lord and Savior, then you will go to heaven when you die
and that is all that matters
whether the new heaven and earth is literal or figurative, well it does not matter
try to focus on things that are important and relative to our lives
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canadianbbw
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May 2 @ 12:25PM
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I am not well versed in the Bible and so probably cannot discuss such things well....and I don't take the Bible literally, but metaphorically.
It would be amazing to have a new Earth after all the damage we have done to this one.
I believe heaven cannot be destroyed, as it is spiritual, and the spirit is immortal.
I believe there is a realm where all life that ever existed, every animal, human, plant, dinosaur, extinct creature...is restored already, and lives. Don't know if that's a physical place, I can't imagine the complexity of heaven from where I am. Or can't remember it.
I agree, what newness awaits must be of the spirit, being closer to the divine inside us all.
I sure don't believe God puts souls in hell, for God is love....we make our own hell, and that may exist beyond this realm in our hearts and minds, until we are ready to come to God.
Sorry, don't mean to be preachy,I don't know how to answer such things, other then, the answer is within each of us.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 12:28PM
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your doctrine is not scriptural,
it is more like that crap that Unity people believe in
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canadianbbw
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May 2 @ 12:36PM
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I'm not sure who you are addressing that to....but I don't waste time debating...or taking offense...to those with little respect to such a personal matter as differing religious/spiritual opinion.
By the way, Hopelessly, I've read a few of your blog comments, I often love what you have to say.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 12:38PM
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I am talking to you
what you believe in is what is known as 'new age' or 'spiritual law'
understand, there is a lot of truth to what you have to say
but to say that Jesus did not literally rise from the dead is simply not scriptual
if you don't believe he did, fine, but don't say you believe in the bible
that is all I am saying
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 12:38PM
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After seeing the comments .....
Mathew 7
13" Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it.
14 "For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it.
15 Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves.
Revelation 3
15 I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or hot.
16 'So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 12:40PM
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Jesus was not a good person, he was not a spiritual warriror
he was, and is, the son of the living God
big difference
Romantic Libra believes in only part of the Bible and not the entire Bible
ask her
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canadianbbw
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May 2 @ 12:51PM
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Moondancer,
I respect your opinions, there is little so personal as what we believe in spiritually. So I cannot put down what someone believes.
There are other beliefs besides scriptual ones...or rather, one may read Scripture in a different way. Still respecting it notwithstanding.
No offense taken, we all have our path.
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 12:54PM
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I guess my comment made perfect sense after all 
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 12:56PM
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MD ... what would happen if a person ONLY BELIEVED part of the company policies?
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:00PM
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the sinners will be in hell for eternity
(Matthew 9:9-13) 9 Next, while passing along from there, Jesus caught sight of a man named Matthew seated at the tax office, and he said to him: “Be my follower.” Thereupon he did rise up and follow him. 10 Later, while he was reclining at the table in the house, look! many tax collectors and sinners came and began reclining with Jesus and his disciples. 11 But on seeing this the Pharisees began to say to his disciples: “Why is it that YOUR teacher eats with tax collectors and sinners?” 12 Hearing [them], he said: “Persons in health do not need a physician, but the ailing do. 13 Go, then, and learn what this means, ‘I want mercy, and not sacrifice.’ For I came to call, not righteous people, but sinners.”
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:01PM
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if Jesus is your Lord and Savior, then you will go to heaven when you die
and that is all that matters
(Matthew 11:16-19) 16 “With whom shall I compare this generation? It is like young children sitting in the marketplaces who cry out to their playmates, 17 saying, ‘We played the flute for YOU, but YOU did not dance; we wailed, but YOU did not beat yourselves in grief.’ 18 Correspondingly, John came neither eating nor drinking, yet people say, ‘He has a demon’; 19 the Son of man did come eating and drinking, still people say, ‘Look! A man gluttonous and given to drinking wine, a friend of tax collectors and sinners.’ All the same, wisdom is proved righteous by its works.”
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 1:10PM
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ok ok ok .... perhaps I tried too hard not to be too preachy ... the facts are as you say in your last comment HH
all I was trying to do is state that in a different way ... without offending the lukewarm out there
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MintSummer
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May 2 @ 1:19PM
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Every thing can be interpreted differently by different people ... but you have to think about the fact that the word of God was given to man to write down and pass through the generations. So not only did MAN write down what HE heard, it was then TRANSLATED into english by another MAN by what HE read.
I believe in God ... I have faith that for the most part the bible is correct, despite the imperfection of man. But you have to find your own way, follow your own heart ... b/c the biggest issue that the bible claims is that God gave each of us free will. In the end, we all face judgement, and only you know just how much you deserve to be judged.
God Bless. 
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:19PM
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God is going to remake everything after the rapture
all will be made new
(2 Peter 3:6-7) . . .. 7 But by the same word the heavens and the earth that are now are stored up for fire and are being reserved to the day of judgment and of destruction of the ungodly men.
If by this it is meant the heavens as in Jehovah God's dwelling place, then why does it say?:
(Isaiah 14:12) 12 “O how you have fallen from heaven, you shining one, son of the dawn! How you have been cut down to the earth, you who were disabling the nations! .. about Nebuchadnezzar???
If by the earth it means the literal planet, then why does the Bible say?:
(Psalm 78:69) 69 And he began to build his sanctuary just like the heights, Like the earth that he has founded to time indefinite.
and also
90 Your faithfulness is for generation after generation.
You have solidly fixed the earth, that it may keep standing.
and if it should be taken most literally then why oh why does the Bible say this?:
(Psalm 66:4) 4 All the earth will bow down to you, And they will make melody to you, they will make melody to your name.” Se´lah. .. and in the context of talking about men, not planet!
M’Clintock and Strong’s Cyclopaedia (1891, Vol. IV, p. 122) comments: “In Isa. lxv, 17, a new heaven and a new earth signify a new government, new kingdom, new people.”
As you can see, my thoughts on the subject are not new, not just mine, and not the thoughts of just one religious group, either. They are the same thoughts had by many scholars who have studied the Bible up to studying the meaning of words and the context of their usage.
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blueyed_cdn_girl
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May 2 @ 1:21PM
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Quote Jesus was not a good person, he was not a spiritual warriror
he was, and is, the son of the living God
big difference Quote
So true moondancer97 !!!!!
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:22PM
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whether the new heaven and earth is literal or figurative, well it does not matter
(Romans 1:28-32) 28 And just as they did not approve of holding God in accurate knowledge, God gave them up to a disapproved mental state, to do the things not fitting, 29 filled as they were with all unrighteousness, wickedness, covetousness, badness, being full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malicious disposition, being whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, insolent, haughty, self-assuming, inventors of injurious things, disobedient to parents, 31 without understanding, false to agreements, having no natural affection, merciless. 32 Although these know full well the righteous decree of God, that those practicing such things are deserving of death, they not only keep on doing them but also consent with those practicing them.
It doesn't mean you have to know everything, dearheart .. but it does mean you have to actively put in an effort!
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yashaenka
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May 2 @ 1:27PM
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Maybe you should ask the Millerites or John the Devine!!!
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 1:37PM
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if that's the way you feel mint ... then why believe any of it? why make a comment? why on earth would you believe even a part of the Bible? upon experimenting with chemicals, the slightest addition or subtraction error could do untold things - so why?
The fact is, is that certain translations are "in sync" with the documents of the last 2000+ years and the Bible even states that ALL Scripture is God-Breathed
2 Timothy 3
16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:48PM
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the sinners will be in hell for eternity
I had a big long comment prepared but it got rejected for allegedly having html coding and no matter what they say, hitting the "back" button does not make it where you can fix it: it just disappears, in my experience. So, here is the short version:
(Psalm 31:12) 12 Like someone dead and not in the heart, I have been forgotten;. . .
This is the big punishment. God said in other places, where it speaks of people burning their own children, that such acts have never come up into his heart. And by that he means it is no part of his desires, nothing he thinks should be done by anyone even him.
The Bible also says that the dead know nothing. If they were in hell, they would know pain, they would know guilt .. they would no more than nothing.
The worst punishment God would or will inflict is simply as it states above: to forget .. to turn away from those who already turned away from Him.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:49PM
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I'm not sure who you are addressing that to....but I don't waste time debating...or taking offense...to those with little respect to such a personal matter as differing religious/spiritual opinion.
That is a wonderful attitude to have!
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:52PM
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Romantic Libra believes in only part of the Bible and not the entire Bible
ask her
Oh alright: I'll bite: where did that statement come from?
I am not Romantic Libra and she has not, at least up to the point of you making that comment, been here commenting on this blog! So ... ????
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:55PM
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your doctrine is not scriptural,
it is more like that crap that Unity people believe in
Okay, I know you were not talking to me this time and you were even saying it in regards to things that I would agree are not scriptural and which I do not believe, but all the same: that is rude and uncalled for.
Jesus did not go around talking about "that crap the Samaritans believe" or "that crap the Sanhedrin teach" either! Tell her what you believe is right, even tell her what you believe she is wrong about if you will, but there is no reason to be verbally attacking "the Unity people". 
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 1:56PM
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I guess my comment made perfect sense after all
It was a very good and well timed comment, indeed! 
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misschoos
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May 2 @ 1:57PM
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Where would we all go if it was all gone 
 religion, I refuse.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 2:03PM
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Jesus was not a good person, he was not a spiritual warriror
he was, and is, the son of the living God
So Jesus was a bad person or a fair to middlin' slightly moral but at least he was trying person who couldn't hold his own in a religious debate or a fight?
Jesus was a good person, by our standards of good: he was very nice, patient, helped others, honored God, helped out his mother, and forgave his friends their faults.
He is also the one who trounced Satan's arse right out of heaven and probaby, but I'm not sure, the one who slew 180,000 men or so in one night.
He is also the one who trounced Satan's arse during the time Satan was trying to tempt him.
So yes .. he was and is a good person, a perfect reflection of God the Father who is good, and yes he is spiritual and a warrior, and a spiritual warrior .. and the son of God.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 2:05PM
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Maybe you should ask the Millerites or John the Devine!!!
That was more than a little cryptic .. I don't even know who you were talking to. .or what about, really.
Could you please put that into the form a real informative sentence or paragraph, expressing your own viewpoint and, preferably, not purposely insulting anyone elses?
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 2:09PM
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Where would we all go if it was all gone
For a non-religous woman you ask a very good question! 
Thank you, as always, for making a comment.
For those of you who don't know, I asked this lovely person to make comments sometimes as I find them very entertaining. So she goes out of her way to do it, even on blogs she woudn't normally read.
What a sweetheart! Give her a round of applause! 
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misschoos
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May 2 @ 2:14PM
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Now what makes you think I am non religious
I might be.
I just don't discuss religion.....until my religious blog comes 
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 2:14PM
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You know what, Moondancer97? or 98? or whatever number you are to by now:
I could probably make a good 50 more comments answering parts of your first two comments on this blog; but I'm not going to, not right now.
Instead I'm going to tell you this: Where you grate on my nerves is that you are very unyielding. Now I don't mean you should be yielding as in compromisng what you truly believe, but you apparently can't read something that differs from your own beliefs and consider why the person might believe it and respond to that. Or even respond to why they shouldn't believe it by your own explanation of what you believe.
You just dictate policy and generally act like you think you are the Christ .. which is funny as he never just dicated policy. He explained, he listened, and he gave assurances far more than ever he did condemnation!
If you are going to be commenting, why not really comment on what was written?
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 2:16PM
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Now what makes you think I am non religious
I might be.
I just don't discuss religion.....until my religious blog comes
Okay .. okay .. you said something to me, at least once, like "I don't do religion" So maybe you just meant the blogs. I don't have a perfect memory or mind reading ability so sorry if I got that wrong.
I hope this doesn't mean I will be smitten with frogs now! 
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yashaenka
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May 2 @ 2:25PM
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Maybe you should ask the Millerites or John the Devine!!!
That was more than a little cryptic .. I don't even know who you were talking to. .or what about, really.
Could you please put that into the form a real informative sentence or paragraph, expressing your own viewpoint and, preferably, not purposely insulting anyone elses?
As I remember you profess to follow the way of 7th Day Adventist path. The Millerites had there belief system turn to ash in 1844 when they once again cited a mathematical formula that accurately predicted the end times in 1843.
Based on John the Devines writings called Revelations in the bible.
The 7th Day Adventist are what roses from the ashes of the Millerites but have avoided any predictions by year and date since them. It really surprises me you are unaware who either is!!!
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missalex
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May 2 @ 2:57PM
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(2 Peter 3:13) 13 But there are new heavens and a new earth that we are awaiting according to his promise, and in these righteousness is to dwell.
(Isaiah 65:17) 17 “For here I am creating new heavens and a new earth; and the former things will not be called to mind, neither will they come up into the heart.
I'll give this a shot, I think it's just another way of explaining how you are eternal. ENERGY DOES NOT DIE. I think you'll be somewhere, physical or not. concsious of it all or not.
This place will always be recreated, it's changing every second. Everything is new.
We live in the present. But, it's changing every second.
volition.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 3:02PM
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As I remember you profess to follow the way of 7th Day Adventist path. The Millerites had there belief system turn to ash in 1844 when they once again cited a mathematical formula that accurately predicted the end times in 1843.
Based on John the Devines writings called Revelations in the bible.
The 7th Day Adventist are what roses from the ashes of the Millerites but have avoided any predictions by year and date since them. It really surprises me you are unaware who either is!!!
okay, well 1) I have a bad memory and 2) So do you !
I have never been in any way affliliated or associated with the Seventh Day Adventists and, in fact, I sometimes feel that some of their beliefs are only things that those heavily into bestiality or gene splicing could truly love. But, I do think they are right on the money on some issues! I feel that about a lot of religions .. on some issues!
I have not professed to follow the way of any path .. only that I do believe there is a path and that the Holy Scripture is there to help you follow it. Do I follow it? ... sometimes. .. in some ways .. if I did, and I knew I did, I would be baptised.
If I was baptised I would be one of Jehovah's Witnesses, not Seventh Day Adventist.
Now, if you please, what does your comments have to do with my blog? With the "new heavens" and "new earth" and what those terms really mean? Because I see no correlation, simply argumentation, thus far.
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yashaenka
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May 2 @ 3:15PM
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In your blog you postulated this "the Bible say that there are going to be a new heaven and a new earth and the old ones will be destroyed;".
So making the mistake that you might be 7D A since I remember your defence of them in some previous blog I naturally pointed to Revelations as the biblical source for end times. Where the Millerites and John the Devine with one pointing to a end date and the other the author of Revelations come in to play. But of course that was my assumption that you knew this.
But reviewing all your response post I can see why you missed the connection it is never easy.
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conny90045
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May 2 @ 3:44PM
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That was really rude Moondancer and not right  
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 3:54PM
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although moondancer is sometimes "pointed" in his comments and perhaps not sensitive ... he is at least being - what I perceive to be - honest or straightforward about his position, which is different than the wishy washy points of others here or what they say elsewhere ....
Sorry to get off track here HH ... wasn't speaking of you - you are always consistent
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 4:46PM
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There is only one God and there is only one Bible thus there is only one truth
Jesus said "I am the way, the truth and the life."
he is not 'a' way, he is 'the' way
someone said we all have our different paths, no way, that is a spiritual lie
better read the bible
and yes, it does discuss hell for eternity
as for Connie, she is hypocrite who pretends to be a christian and then uses profanity
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 5:00PM
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I am NOT a religious person----I am a christian
big difference
there are all kinds of religions, yet only one truth
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 5:01PM
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In your blog you postulated this "the Bible say that there are going to be a new heaven and a new earth and the old ones will be destroyed;".
First of all, to any Seventh Day Adventists out there: I am truly sorry if I offended you by what I said in the comment prior to this one. That is what some of your beliefs remind me of, in fact, but there is probably a better way to have worded that and I do not in any way believe that it means it's the sort of thing your religious group would advocate!
Second of all, let's define postulate, shall we? Postulate: a starting assumption from which all other statements are logically derived.
Now, really, did I postulate that the Bible say that there are going to be a new heaven and a new earth and the old ones will be destroyed?
No, I most certainly did not.
I quoted from the Bible and I mentioned why I was bringing up the subject, which was in regards to other persons questioning me on that subject based on their own assumptions.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 5:04PM
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quit being apologetic
the 7th Day Adventist movement is a false religions predicated upon a false teacher
do the research and you see what I mean----I have
I have found that people would rather believe what they believe and then they get ofended if someone disagrees with them
rather than look for the truth to begin with
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 5:09PM
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So making the mistake that you might be 7D A since I remember your defence of them in some previous blog
I've also defended Muslims, Jews, women, men, Catholics, Buddhists, and once (at least) even you - does that mean I am you and you are a Jewish/Muslim/Catholic/Buddhist she-male?
Please say no! I have enough trouble figuring out my wardrobe!
You've read enough of my blogs that by now you should know that I am quite in favor of Jehovah's Witnesses but not formally affiliated with any religious group.
I naturally pointed to Revelations as the biblical source for end times.
Okay. I understand that bit .. that Revelations is one of the biblical sources for information on the end times and also the main one, in some respects.
But then you lose me again right here:
Where the Millerites and John the Devine with one pointing to a end date and the other the author of Revelations come in to play. But of course that was my assumption that you knew this.
I have no clue what you are actually trying to say. I understand all the big words, but it's like there are large chunks of information missing or something.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 5:11PM
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If you are truly seeking for the truth, I would challenge you to read a book called "No more christian nice guy" In it, the author show, through the scripture, that the least tolerant, least politically correct person who ever lived is Jesus Christ. No way would Jesus say, "please forgive me if I have offended you and your religion." Never. Jesus spoke the unapologetic truth. And those that became offended, well that is their problem. And Jesus did not take time to explain either.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 5:14PM
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I'll give this a shot, I think it's just another way of explaining how you are eternal. ENERGY DOES NOT DIE. I think you'll be somewhere, physical or not. concsious of it all or not.
This place will always be recreated, it's changing every second. Everything is new.
We live in the present. But, it's changing every second.
volition .
MissAlex, that is a very interesting interpretation! Not saying I agree with you, mind you; but I do thank you for sharing your thoughts and for being so gosh-darned pleasant whilst doing so! That's great!
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 5:16PM
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There is only one God and there is only one Bible thus there is only one truth Oh look! Finally .. something I can honestly say we agree about! And if someone pops up to argue over the definition of the word Bible, etc. ... oooo h... because I think we all know that Moondancer means the Holy Scriptures. Right?
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 5:17PM
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Jesus said "I am the way, the truth and the life."
he is not 'a' way, he is 'the' way
someone said we all have our different paths, no way, that is a spiritual lie
better read the bible
Actually I agree with all that too, except that it's presented kind of rudely. But, the basic concepts, premises, etc :
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 5:19PM
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yes the holy scriptures
but make sure they have not been tampered with
The Jehovah's Witness Bible is not the same Holy Bible
as well as "The Book of Momons'
also a book called "The Way' is not scriptural yet has seriously altered
read either the KJV or the NIV version and stick with that
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 5:25PM
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we need to remember one vital thing-----sincerity is not the path to heaven---truth is
if you are sincere, yet you are wrong, then you are still wrong---just sincerely wrong
being sincere does not make a person more right
everyone is sincere, if you think about it
no matter what they beleive, they are sincere
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 5:35PM
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moondancer has some very valid points ... perhaps we can look at Ezekiel for a moment - and this may be where he is coming from
Ezekiel 33
8 "When I say to the wicked, 'O wicked man, you will surely die,' and you do not speak to warn the wicked from his way, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require from your hand.
9 "But if you on your part warn a wicked man to turn from his way and he does not turn from his way, he will die in his iniquity, but you have delivered your life.
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RVerwolf
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May 2 @ 5:36PM
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Moondancer, if there is only one path, how/where/what makes you so utterly positive that it is the correct one that you are on?...when there are so many variations/interpretations of what the scriptures say/mean?... How do you "know" that "your" interpretations are the correct ones?..Somebody tell you, so you folllow blindly?.. or have you done enough research on your own to make such a "declarative" statement?... or,...have you personally been given the "word" by God, himself?
Scripture says that the "doorway is narrow"...not that it is "single" lane passage only...get off your self righteous "high horses", all of you that believe that only "your" particular path is correct...because in that alone,.. you are proving that you are on the "wrong" one...
Good blog, Arlette, as always...lol...I do love your mind...
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 5:41PM
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as for Connie, she is hypocrite who pretends to be a christian and then uses profanity
Hypocrite: from the Hebrew root cha·neph´ meaning a person who pretends to be what he is not; a person whose actions are out of harmony with his words.
When used as an adjective cha.neph´ may be defined as godless, profane, irreligious
As a verb it may be defined as inclining away from right, polluted, profane . . . , inclining away from right.”
In the Scriptures cha·neph´ appears in parallel with those forgetting God :
(Job 8:13) 13 Thus are the pathways of all those forgetting God, And the very hope of an apostate will perish,
the wicked:
(Job 20:5) 5 That the joyful cry of wicked people is short And the rejoicing of an apostate is for a moment?
evildoers:
(Isaiah 9:17) 17 That is why Jehovah will not rejoice even over their young men, and upon their fatherless boys and upon their widows he will have no mercy; because all of them are apostates and evildoers and every mouth is speaking senselessness. In view of all this his anger has not turned back, but his hand is stretched out still.
and it is used in contrast with the upright and innocent:
(Job 17:8) 8 Upright people stare in amazement at this, And even the innocent one gets excited over the apostate.
The Greek word rendered “hypocrite” (hy·po·kri·tes´) means “one who answers,” as well as meaning a stage actor. Greek and Roman actors employed large masks with mechanical devices for amplifying the voice. Hence, the Greek word hy·po·kri·tes´ came to be used in a metaphoric sense to apply to one playing false, or one putting on a pretense
(Job 34:30) . . .So that an apostate man may not reign, Nor there be snares of the people.
Hypocrites are the unfaithful ones : (Luke 12:46) 46 the master of that slave will come on a day that he is not expecting [him] and in an hour that he does not know, and he will punish him with the greatest severity and assign him a part with the unfaithful ones.. . .
Hypocrites are the cunning ones: (Mark 12:14-15) 14 On arrival these said to him: “Teacher, we know you are truthful and you do not care for anybody, for you do not look upon men’s outward appearance, but you teach the way of God in line with truth: Is it lawful to pay head tax to Caesar or not? 15 Shall we pay, or shall we not pay?” Detecting their hypocrisy, he said to them: “Why do YOU put me to the test? Bring me a de·nar´i·us to look at.”. . .
Hypocrites are the wicked ones: (Matthew 22:18) 18 But Jesus, knowing their wickedness, said: “Why do YOU put me to the test, hypocrites?
Hypocrites are the pretenders: (Galatians 2:13) 13 The rest of the Jews also joined him in putting on this pretense, so that even Bar´na·bas was led along with them in their pretense.
Jesus Christ identified as hypocrites persons who make gifts of mercy with showy display, who pray and fast to be seen of men, and who pick on the strawlike faults of their brothers but do nothing about removing their own rafterlike faults. Christ classified as such those who claimed to be God’s servants but who failed to discern the significance of the time in which they were living and the events that were occurring, while readily drawing conclusions from the appearance of earth and sky as to what the weather would be like.
Now, I have no idea if Connie fits into that sort of category of person or not, as I do not know her. I do know that I have never personally witnessed her being deliberately mean or cruel to anyone.
I also know that I have never intentionally seen her teach someone falsely or pretend to be more righteous than she actually is.
So far as I know, she's a woman who is imperfect and makes mistakes. What else she is, for the good or for the bad, is between her and God.
And God knows I have a lot of trouble with profanity, myself.. but I don't think it's hypocrisy because I know it's wrong, I say it's wrong, and I do try not to do it. Sometimes I even succeed, mostly through praying to Jehovah for help in learning better.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 5:43PM
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you know what? you bring up a great point
how do I know that I am right
first of all, regardless how you read my words here, I am not arrogant
there is a way to know if you are on the right path or not
Jesus said, "You will find me, when you seek me with all your heart." In other words, when you are willing to seek what the truth is, not what is popular, you will find it and the Holy Spirit will confirm it in your heart
I have always said that there is only one way to know if something is true, and that is to know the truth for yourself
and this can only be done by being willing to seek for it on your own terms
there is no other way
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 5:47PM
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RVerwolf .... I understand your concern and questioning .... many before you have asked, and many after you will also ... it all comes down to following "certain" criteria of being accepted as evidence to support statements ... such as historically, grammatically, inspirationally (without pride or ego such as certain books of the apocrypha) correct ... I think MD is pointing out the later of the two as generally speaking the former aligns quite often ... in fact, there is a close likeness of the koran and the first 5 books of the Bible.
having said that, concerning the New testament - which is where the arguments seem to stem ... There are over 24,600 manuscripts of the New Testatment and over 24,000 original manuscripts of portions of the New Testament. careful evaluation of these by historians, linguistics experts, theologians, archeologists, and so on ... there are numerous examples of error, either in part or whole, to the validity of the historical and/or the grammatical accuracy of "certain" versions
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 5:53PM
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I agree with the last blog
if a person really wants the truth, they will find it
if the person just wants to defend their position, then nothing will be gained
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:04PM
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and yes, it does discuss hell for eternity
I'm throwing this one in here just to give you more to think about :
(Numbers 19:11) 11 Anyone touching the corpse of any human soul must also be unclean seven days.
*** Footnote ***
“Human soul.” Lit., “soul of an earthling man.” Heb., ne´phesh ´a·dham´; Gr., psy·khes´ an·thro´pou.
HELL
A word used in the King James Version (as well as in the Catholic Douay Version and most older translations) to translate the Hebrew she´ohl´ and the Greek hai´des. In the King James Version the word “hell” is rendered from she´ohl´ 31 times and from hai´des 10 times. This version is not consistent, however, since she´ohl´ is also translated 31 times “grave” and 3 times “pit.” In the Douay Version she´ohl´ is rendered “hell” 64 times, “pit” once, and “death” once.
The Sixty-Six Occurrences of Sheol
“Sheol” occurs 66 times in the New World Translation of the Hebrew Scriptures, namely, in Ge 37:35; 42:38; 44:29, 31; Nu 16:30, 33; De 32:22; 1Sa 2:6; 2Sa 22:6; 1Ki 2:6, 9; Job 7:9; 11:8; 14:13; 17:13, 16; 21:13; 24:19; 26:6; Ps 6:5; 9:17; 16:10; 18:5; 30:3; 31:17; 49:14, 14, 15; 55:15; 86:13; 88:3; 89:48; 116:3; 139:8; 141:7; Pr 1:12; 5:5; 7:27; 9:18; 15:11, 24; 23:14; 27:20; 30:16; Ec 9:10; Ca 8:6; Isa 5:14; [7:11]; 14:9, 11, 15; 28:15, 18; 38:10, 18; 57:9; Eze 31:15, 16, 17; 32:21, 27; Ho 13:14, 14; Am 9:2; Jon 2:2; Hab 2:5.
The occurrences of “Sheol” in the Hebrew Scriptures cover the 65 times it occurs in M, and one instance in Isa 7:11, where see ftn. In all cases the New World Translation uses “Sheol” for the Hebrew word she´ohl´. The Greek Septuagint generally renders she´ohl´ as hai´des.
The derivation of the Hebrew word she´ohl´ is uncertain. According to one derivation, it means the “place of inquiry”; according to another, the “hollow place” or “resting-place”; according to still another, “the place that asks for and demands all without distinction of persons.” It is in the earth and is always associated with the dead, and plainly means the common grave of mankind, gravedom, or the earthly (not sea) region of the dead. In contrast, the Hebrew word qe´ver means an individual grave or burial place.—Ge 23:4, 6, 9, 20.
*** Rbi8 p. 1574 4B “Sheol,” “Hades”—The Common Grave of Mankind; Gravedom ***
The Ten Occurrences of Hades
“Hades,” perhaps meaning “the unseen place,” occurs ten times in the New World Translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures, namely, in Mt 11:23; 16:18; Lu 10:15; 16:23; Ac 2:27, 31; Re 1:18; 6:8; 20:13, 14.
In Ac 2:27, Peter’s quotation of Ps 16:10 shows Hades is the equivalent of Sheol and is applied to the common grave of mankind (in contrast with the Greek word ta´phos, an individual grave). The Latin word corresponding to Hades is in·fer´nus (sometimes in´fe·rus). It means “that which lies beneath; the lower region,” and well applies to the grave. It is thus a fitting approximation of the Greek and Hebrew terms.
In the inspired Scriptures these words are associated with death and the dead, not with life and the living. (Re 20:13) In themselves the words “Sheol” and “Hades” contain no thought or hint of pleasure or pain.
Concerning this use of “hell” to translate these original words from the Hebrew and Greek, Vine’s Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words (1981, Vol. 2, p. 187) says: “HADES . . . It corresponds to ‘Sheol’ in the O.T. [Old Testament]. In the A.V. of the O.T. [Old Testament] and N.T. [New Testament], it has been unhappily rendered ‘Hell.’”
Collier’s Encyclopedia (1986, Vol. 12, p. 28) says concerning “Hell”: “First it stands for the Hebrew Sheol of the Old Testament and the Greek Hades of the Septuagint and New Testament. Since Sheol in Old Testament times referred simply to the abode of the dead and suggested no moral distinctions, the word ‘hell,’ as understood today, is not a happy translation.”
Webster’s Third New International Dictionary, unabridged, under “Hell” says: “fr[om] . . . helan to conceal.” The word “hell” thus originally conveyed no thought of heat or torment but simply of a ‘covered over or concealed place.’ In the old English dialect the expression “helling potatoes” meant, not to roast them, but simply to place the potatoes in the ground or in a cellar.
The Grolier Universal Encyclopedia (1971, Vol. 9, p. 205) under “Hell” says: “Hindus and Buddhists regard hell as a place of spiritual cleansing and final restoration. Islamic tradition considers it as a place of everlasting punishment.”
I am not Hindu, I am not Buddhist, I am not Islamic: I am not yet Christian but I aspire to be such and therefore I believe not in "Hell".
The idea of suffering after death is found among the pagan religious teachings of ancient peoples in Babylon and Egypt. Babylonian and Assyrian beliefs depicted the “nether world . . . as a place full of horrors, . . . presided over by gods and demons of great strength and fierceness.” Although ancient Egyptian religious texts do not teach that the burning of any individual victim would go on forever, they do portray the “Other World” as featuring “pits of fire” for “the damned.”—The Religion of Babylonia and Assyria, by Morris Jastrow, Jr., 1898, p. 581; The Book of the Dead, with introduction by E. Wallis Budge, 1960, pp. 135, 144, 149, 151, 153, 161, 200.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:11PM
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although moondancer is sometimes "pointed" in his comments and perhaps not sensitive ... he is at least being - what I perceive to be - honest or straightforward about his position, which is different than the wishy washy points of others here or what they say elsewhere ....
Lack of sensitivity to some degree is forgiveable However, sneak attacks and then cancelling your account to try to start arguments and prevent people from defending themselves really is not, as such. Only today this has not happened so far ... so today it is forgiveable that it was done yesterday.. and the other days.
What bugs me is that it's his position (or hers, as the case may be) and it's not a discussion, it's not a sharing of ideas or beliefs: and it should never be your position as religion is not a debate. It is your beliefs, your feelings, your opinions, but when you are talking about what the Bible says it is not something you are morally allowed to flip the words and meanings around on to suit your mood! And no one should assume infallibility. It's one thing to say "I researched it, I examined those ideas, I have come to this belief because of ..." and quite another to just go "You're wrong!" with or without insults, but definitely without explanation or sharing of ideas.
That bugs me!
But I will say this for Moondancer: he keeps plugging away!
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:17PM
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I am NOT a religious person----I am a christian
I never understood that view point. If 'Christian' is not a religion then how are the other ones considered to be false religions?
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 6:17PM
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perhaps I have not come across well here, although I do have my friends and fans
but the reality is that I am a highly open minded person
ever here of words such as 'schtoma' or 'cognitive disonance'
these are terms to describe someone who is narrow minded
I am not narrow minded, I just know what I know is true because I have spent my life studying the truth
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:19PM
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there are all kinds of religions, yet only one truth
Then it would be the true religion
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 6:20PM
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if you use the word 'religion' to define a christian, then you dillute the word 'christian' because you enmesh it with all other religions
I prefer not to use the word 'religious' to describe me because it has so many set preconceptions
that is all I am saying
the biggest group of people in hell will be religious people
the next biggest will be hypocrites
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:21PM
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quit being apologetic
No!
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 6:23PM
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just like the words 'idiot' and 'moron' have a certain perception, we often think of them as insults
yet the reality is that these are different levels of mental illness used by a therapist
if a person calls you a moron, he is insulting you
if a therapist calls you a moron, he is defining where you are on a psychological scale
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 6:24PM
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don't spend your life arguing about things that many people will never agree with
seek the truth and spend your life loving Jesus
that is all that matters
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:25PM
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the 7th Day Adventist movement is a false religions predicated upon a false teacher
The 7th Day Adventist people, however, are descendants of Adam who was created by God and later replaced by Jesus so, any who chose to come to him are his children as much as anyone else who chooses to come to him and embrace his teachings.
So is everyone else on the planet.
I am not going to be purposely rude to persons who do not believe like me and I am certainly not going to do it because they do not believe like you, when I myself do not believe many of the things that you do believe.
One of the things that I do most whole-heartedly believe is that Jesus was never rude to those he believed had been taught falsely or had been taught right but had fallen into the ways of sin, either. It was the teachers with their false pride, their little ego trips, thinking they were better than everyone else, that he took the most exception to.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:26PM
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do the research and you see what I mean----I have
Yes, then, before you get uppity with me, at least prove that you have done the research - I have!
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:30PM
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I have found that people would rather believe what they believe and then they get ofended if someone disagrees with them
rather than look for the truth to begin with
And I have found that you are correct in the words you typed, per the quote above.
Yet I have found, in your practice, that I am offended quite regularly by your attacks and dismissive attitude.
I have found that it is much easier, better for everyone's health, and more in harmony with the teachings of the Christ to share ideas and research the Bible for yourself. Most people do not respond with an open mind or heart to threats and intimidation .. they may mouth the words you care to hear, but then you have just created a hypocrite and are one yourself.
One cannot convert .. one can only teach, or warn, and hope for the best. But if you drive them away with your contempt or your anger you will never have a chance to do either .. and then you are not following the teachings of the Christ.
Where is the mildness of temper, the long sufferingness, the peace, the love?
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:33PM
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If you are truly seeking for the truth, I would challenge you to read a book called "No more christian nice guy"
Really? I would think it was best found in the Holy Scriptures.
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:37PM
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In it, the author show, through the scripture, that the least tolerant, least politically correct person who ever lived is Jesus Christ.
'Least tolerant" and 'least politically correct' are opposites. Being politically correct is not about tolerance; it's about being intolerant of anything that is too truthful.
Tolerance is about not harming or pushing the other people away in disgust just because they are different from you.
The son of God, who ate with tax collectors and sinners, was far from intolerant!
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:40PM
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No way would Jesus say, "please forgive me if I have offended you and your religion." Never. Jesus spoke the unapologetic truth.
Yes, because no way would Jesus be an imperfect human in bad health and easily distracted.
But, did he go around insulting other people? No he did not. Not except for those one people, who were liars and worse.
Can you prove any of your claims or beliefs through the Holy Scriptures, please? Or through an examination of them?
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 6:43PM
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you are spending all your time attacking me and being defensive
rather than just love Jesus
I love all people yet cannot agree with all people because to do so, would only be filled with contradiction
I wish everyone found the truth, yet as the Bible says, "Straight in the way and narrow is the gate and few will find heaven. Crooked is the way and wide is the gate and most people will find hell."
If I had it my way, I would be a catholic. It is a feel good faith.
The problem? It is a false doctrine that teaches many lies.
So I don't allow my feelings to run my life, I seek for the truth
I am not being arrogant or dismissive here, just honest
you must live your life as you choose
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:44PM
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And those that became offended, well that is their problem.
(Ecclesiastes 7:8-9) 8 Better is the end afterward of a matter than its beginning. Better is one who is patient than one who is haughty in spirit. 9 Do not hurry yourself in your spirit to become offended, for the taking of offense is what rests in the bosom of the stupid ones.
At first you might think that's an agreement with you, but think again. Why do you give offense if not that you are first offended? Surely you would not do it to someone who already agrees with your position!
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:46PM
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And Jesus did not take time to explain either.
(Luke 24:13-27) 13 But, look! on that very day two of them were journeying to a village about seven miles distant from Jerusalem [and] named Em·ma´us, 14 and they were conversing with each other over all these things that had come about. 15 Now as they were conversing and discussing, Jesus himself approached and began walking with them; 16 but their eyes were kept from recognizing him. 17 He said to them: “What are these matters that YOU are debating between yourselves as YOU walk along?” And they stood still with sad faces. 18 In answer the one named Cle´o·pas said to him: “Are you dwelling as an alien by yourself in Jerusalem and so do not know the things that have occurred in her in these days?” 19 And he said to them: “What things?” They said to him: “The things concerning Jesus the Naz·a·rene´, who became a prophet powerful in work and word before God and all the people; 20 and how our chief priests and rulers handed him over to the sentence of death and impaled him. 21 But we were hoping that this [man] was the one destined to deliver Israel; yes, and besides all these things, this makes the third day since these things occurred. 22 Moreover, certain women from among us also astonished us, because they had been early to the memorial tomb 23 but did not find his body and they came saying they had also seen a supernatural sight of angels, who said he is alive. 24 Further, some of those with us went off to the memorial tomb; and they found it so, just as the women had said, but they did not see him.” 25 So he said to them: “O senseless ones and slow in heart to believe on all the things the prophets spoke! 26 Was it not necessary for the Christ to suffer these things and to enter into his glory?” 27 And commencing at Moses and all the Prophets he interpreted to them things pertaining to himself in all the Scriptures.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 6:48PM
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I actually agree with you on this one, to a degree
I never feel it is right to offend someone
but some people get offended no matter what
big difference
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:49PM
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And Jesus did not take time to explain either.
Come to think of it: ever read the Sermon On The Mount?
Or the book of Revelations?
If that wasn't explaining, then what is?
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 6:57PM
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he did not take time to explain to those who chose to be offended because he realized that no matter what he said, they still would not agree with him
believe me, I know the feeling
same with this blog
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 6:58PM
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The Jehovah's Witness Bible is not the same Holy Bible
There is no such book entitled 'The Jehovah's Witnesses Bible' It is the New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures based in accuracy upon the non-politically-correct actual teachings of Judaism and Christianity.
All translations of the Holy Scripture have the same basic truths and most are almost completely the same in meaning, for those who care to actually know what the meaning is, in every last verse.
Hence why I often quote the King James translation along with the New World Translation and sometimes I also quote other translations.
If you believe something different about the New World Translation then prove it!
You can't .. because it's simply not true. Only people who are afraid that they are wrong, go so far as to lie about the word of God just to win an argument.
The truth is open to all of mankind, they all have access to it .. it is up to them to take up whichever translation they can get a hold of, and learn it.
It is never up to them to lie about God!
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:01PM
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better read a book called "Kingdom of the Cults"
where it discusses indepth the deception of Jehovah's witness teaching
also, they teach that you have to work your way to heaven
the bible says you are saved by faith not works
they also don't believe in eternal hell
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 7:01PM
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we need to remember one vital thing-----sincerity is not the path to heaven
The teachings of the Christ are the path to Heaven and he is a lamp for your foot.
(Acts 2:46-47) 46 And day after day they were in constant attendance at the temple with one accord, and they took their meals in private homes and partook of food with great rejoicing and sincerity of heart, 47 praising God and finding favor with all the people. At the same time Jehovah continued to join to them daily those being saved.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:05PM
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you are picking apart every thing I am saying
taking what I am saying out of context
all I am saying is that every one is sincere
not every one is going to heaven
that is the difference
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:05PM
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you quote one scripture but don't quote others that are more apropos to the situation
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 7:07PM
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if you are sincere, yet you are wrong, then you are still wrong---just sincerely wrong
No, if you are sincere and what you are sincere about is learning the will of God, putting it above your own, then you are right in your sincerity and you will be right in spirit and truth because you are on the correct path.. wherever your current placement is upon that roadway.
Here is something else to think on, regarding both sincerity and tolerance:
(1 Corinthians 5:6-13) 6 YOUR [cause for] boasting is not fine. Do YOU not know that a little leaven ferments the whole lump? 7 Clear away the old leaven, that YOU may be a new lump, according as YOU are free from ferment. For, indeed, Christ our passover has been sacrificed. 8 Consequently let us keep the festival, not with old leaven, neither with leaven of badness and wickedness, but with unfermented cakes of sincerity and truth. 9 In my letter I wrote YOU to quit mixing in company with fornicators, 10 not [meaning] entirely with the fornicators of this world or the greedy persons and extortioners or idolaters. Otherwise, YOU would actually have to get out of the world. 11 But now I am writing YOU to quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man. 12 For what do I have to do with judging those outside? Do YOU not judge those inside, 13 while God judges those outside? “Remove the wicked [man] from among yourselves.”
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 7:08PM
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everyone is sincere, if you think about it
no matter what they beleive, they are sincere
Do you believe Jim Baker was sincere?
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:08PM
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for example, the Bible says "There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end leads only to death."
this is a great scripture that shows that a person can be sincere, yet also wrong
yet you choose to pick my words apart
you are missing my point
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:09PM
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for example, the Bible says "There is a way that seems right to a man, but in the end leads only to death."
this is a great scripture that shows that a person can be sincere, yet also wrong
yet you choose to pick my words apart
you are missing my point
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HopelesslyHopeful
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May 2 @ 7:09PM
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everyone is sincere, if you think about it
no matter what they beleive, they are sincere
(2 Corinthians 1:12) 12 For the thing we boast of is this, to which our conscience bears witness, that with holiness and godly sincerity, not with fleshly wisdom but with God’s undeserved kindness, we have conducted ourselves in the world, but more especially toward YOU.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:10PM
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Jehovah Witness's do not believe in eternal hell but they ignore the scripture in Revelation that says "Anyone whose name was not found written in the Book of Life was thrown into eternal hell fire to burn forever and ever."
what do the words 'forever and ever' mean to you?
time to do away with Jehovah's Witness teaching
they are a false doctrine
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:13PM
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you are mixing apples with oranges
Jim Bakker slipped into a life style that was wrong, and he knew it was wrong
we all sin, I have sinned, and knew it was wrong when I was sinning, yet I did it anyway
you are confusing what I am saying
sad
very sad
you have missed the true Jesus Christ
you cannot get to heaven by knocking on people's doors, you can only get to heaven by being born again, as Jesus said
of course you will tear this apart too
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 7:15PM
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adding fuel
http://www.carm.org/doctrine/Jesusisgod.htm
http://www.jesusisgod.co.za/
http://www.jesus-is-lord.com/jesusgd2.htm
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-t005.html
http://www.jesusismygod.com/home.html
http://www.carm.org/doctrine/isJesusGod.htm
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:15PM
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well you may not get to heaven, yet you at least go this blog to the top of the most popular list
at least you accomplished something
Jesus is Lord
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:20PM
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Answers to My Jehovah's Witness Friends
Author: Thomas Heinze
ISBN: 9780937958582
Price: $6.95 US
Pages: 128 - Paperback
Answers you need to witness effectively to Jehovah's Witnesses
When Jehovah's Witnesses come to your door, have you ever wished you could get them off their memorized scripts and show them what the Bible really teaches?
Learn Critical Facts About:
• The 144,000
• Heaven: who goes there?
• Eternal punishment
• Jesus Christ
• The Holy Spirit
• The Trinity
• The name "Jehovah"
• Should we give blood?
• Your key to the kingdom
• Plus much more!
Have you ever wished you had the information necessary to lovingly show them why their religion is wrong?
Now you can!
Using many quotes from Watchtower leaders, this small book exposes the errors of this false religion, presenting thought-provoking questions Jehovah's Witnesses can't answer. Don't turn them away from your door saying, "I'm not interested." Learn the questions that will make them think, so you can effectively share the true gospel with them.
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:28PM
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A person convinced against his will
is of the same opinion still
this cute little poem expresses so much truth
you cannot change anyone
each person must seek the truth for themselves
I pray that you all find the true Jesus that I know is so real
it is not found in religion, or even a church, it is found in a personal relationship with Jesus Christ
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 7:38PM
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"Every one thinks they are right in their own eyes, till someone else
comes and show them the error of their ways."
---Book of Proverbs
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moondancer97
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May 2 @ 8:16PM
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my final comment on this blog
I love you all and sincerely wish you the very best for life
I am not here to attack anyone, yes I realize it is politically correct to say that all roads lead to heaven, yet for me and my faith, that would be a lie
All I can do is wish you the best and encourage each and every one of you to seek the real truth
be well
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iamlookin4u2
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May 2 @ 9:23PM
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Hi i just wanted to reply regarding debating scripture and give an exsample of the bible. First we should always discuss the scriptures rather then debate to the point we need to feel right.What we learn and what we feel is right is all the matters. We will always continue to learn from others if we discuss the scriptures with LOVE. Let me give you and exsample of scripture.In Genesis chapter 5 verse 32 in the Genealogy on Noah it states Noah was 500 years old and Shen, Ham and Japheth. Now in genealogy the first name mention is the first born which is Shem. Now lets look at Genesis Chapter 10 verse 21 And the children were born to Shem the father of all the children of Eder the brother of Japheth the elder. ok with the 2 verses i showed you it say Japheth was the oldest when in fact Shem was born first and he was the oldest. It should have read Japheth the younger. Now i used the KJV and several others bible state the same except one bible was correct in its translating. The point i am making is even with translations that were inncorect it not worth disputing about. God gave us two commandments to Love God with all your heart mind and strenght and to Love your nieghbor as thyself. I dont think debating will get believers into heaven but love will. I pray you come to peace with God`s words and enjoy them and let us apply them to our daily walk. Your friend Fred
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sparechange64
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May 2 @ 10:30PM
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iamlookin - I think you need to look at this verse again
21 Also to Shem, the father of all the children of Eber, and the older brother of Japheth, children were born
If you follow along proper grammar ... Shem IS Japeth's older brother ... oh ... you must be reading the NIV ... or a sin-off of it such as the UK NIV, or NIRV ....decent versions, but not the most grammatically correct
... such as the NASB ... might interest you to know The Message, NLT, ESV, CEV, ASV, NLV, HCSB, all state Shem to be older
Young's, Darby, The KJ, 21st cen KJ, and new KJ refers to Japeth as "AN Elder"
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