| Jan 15 @ 10:27 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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There is a myth about the Self and God of the universe who sees life as a form of play. But since the Self is what there is and all that there is and thus has no one separate to play with, he plays the cosmic game of hide and seek with himself. He takes on the roles and masks of individual people such as You and I and thus becomes involved in exciting and terrifying adventures, all the time forgetting who he really is. Eventually, however, the Self awakens from his many dreams and fantasies and remembers his true identity., the one and eternal Self of the cosmos who is never born and never dies.
This myth symbolizes a universal experience that has permeated nearly every major religion in one form or another and which lies at the root of much of the world's great creativity. It is a dramatic representation of the experience which we in the West have referred to as Cosmic Consciousness. It has been described in various ways such as enlightenment, The Way, liberation, moksha, Nirvana, satori and even the Kingdom of Heaven in the terminology of Jesus.
The word "personality" comes from the latin word "persona," which originally referred to an actors mask. It is rather a humilating discovery to realize that all the years of effort and turmoil have been spent in a state of slumber, that from our earliest memories of childhood we have been half asleep and have been acting with only partial wareness. We have been hypnotized by the nature of words thus becoming alienated from our own organism and from the larger organism of the universe itself.
Freud was on the right track, yet he failed to carry his narcissism to it's ultimate conclusion in which it would include within itself the whole universe, thus doing away with the separation of the conscious from the unconscious, the subject from the object. Through confusing words and abstractions with reality itself, we have created an artifical role or personality for ourselves and in the process forgotten that it is just a role and not the source of our actions. Society has tricked us into the belief that our minds are inside our heads and act independently from it at the same time that it is also telling us who we are and what we should be doing.
But since the mind then includes all of one's social relationships, it is not inside the skin of the individual at all but is actually outside of it.
The ego-contradiction is the basic thorn which society has implanted since childhood and from which we are suffering without being able to see the vicious circle involved. We have been convinced that we are free and independent agents and yet, the very agent reffered to is actually a social role that is defined by other people and has no freedom to act at all.
To get out of that circle we need a kind of passive awareness of ourselves in every situation. For only awareness, NOW, in the present moment can reveal the true source of action, which is not the ego at all but rather the total environmental field of which the organism is only one side of a mutual polarity.
If one turns their focus to the Ordinary things in life that we pay no mind, instead of all the extraordinary things our minds are beset with, one can find they can get in touch with their actual reality by living in the moment, instead of anticipated moments. Whether you believe in the Mystical or the Practicle in every day living, spending some time in the NOW moment that exist in the Ordinary, provides you a harbor of tranquility against the raging seas of the Extraordinary we as humans are err to spend each day in.
Yasha
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| Jan 15 @ 10:33 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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Yash, just more astute sounding  stuff, sorry. Some truth, but mostly deceptions.
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| Jan 15 @ 10:55 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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Name the deceptions and just where have I stated anything contrary to Religious beliefs in any way. You are showing a tendency to assume what is not present like a hypochondriac's tendency to have psychological illnesses.
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| Jan 15 @ 11:08 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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Okay, personality is a mask from a person's true temperament, true. Self is NOT all there is. Self is the center of satan's kingdom, his throne. So, those who search into themselves find him very easily.
I studied Cosmic Consciousness, it is simply another way that satan uses to deceive people. You are going to die and become a tiny part of some cosmic awareness???? I don't think so. Christianity has derived nor gained nor taken anything from that. You know that stuff is channeled.
As a Christian, we live in the kingdom of heaven and it lives within us. Do you think we want to go back to the everyday existance you speak of, when each day holds new wonder, new joy, new faith and such peace as you cannot imagine, the greatest high there is.
Our roles are not defined by people, but the Lord, the Holy Spirit, and are not social roles but reality for us.
Most of the rest of that is obtuse and I recognize the words, wording and phrasing of my old adversary, satan, yash.
Frued had nothing to give anyone. Were you in love with your mother, have sexual thoughts about her? Come on. His theories belong in the dark ages of Psychiatry.
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| Jan 15 @ 11:18 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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 What a idiot psychophysic babble Self is the center of satan's kingdom, his throne. So, those who search into themselves find him very easily.
By that your are saying talk to the devil to find Self?
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| Jan 15 @ 12:03 PM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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As a Christian, we live in the kingdom of heaven and it lives within us. Do you think we want to go back to the everyday existance you speak of, when each day holds new wonder, new joy, new faith and such peace as you cannot imagine, the greatest high there is. By this you are saying you do not live in this existence, then in reality you are living in a make believe world of your reality that does not include daily living...
Okay, personality is a mask from a person's true temperament, true. Self is NOT all there is. Self is the center of satan's kingdom, his throne. So, those who search into themselves find him very easily. Yes I agree you embrace satan and found him easily lost within your own hallucinations of this existence.
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| Jan 15 @ 12:13 PM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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EGO, VANITY, PRIDE, JEALOUSY hmm, all those are self, yash. I suppose all THOSE are of God? I think not, but they are all of SELF, yash. Now, I wonder who is there? Search and you will find that evil old thing, for by denying Jesus, you let that thing move into you.
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| Jan 15 @ 12:17 PM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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There you go again Bev, trying to make the reality that we live in definable by faith alone, that is ignorant to the extreme. Try for once to read the words written and do not put a religious spin on it.
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| Jan 15 @ 2:14 PM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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Heaveninawildflower
Posts: 15,360
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Self - self-reliance, self-respect, self-esteem...what are we without these?
I see where you're coming from Bev, but it's the old ego and the id thing - there are both positives and negatives about 'self'...
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| Jan 15 @ 3:33 PM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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Yes, heaven, you are right, but we have to develop those things, the other things are simply inherrant.
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| Jan 15 @ 7:03 PM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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Heaveninawildflower
Posts: 15,360
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we have to develop those things, the other things are simply inherent.
Sorry, but I don't buy that. I was pretty damned self-reliant when I was four, and my brother broke his arm...I don't think I'm all that unusual either. It mostly depends on whether we NEED to handle crises early or late...I sure didn't have any practice for it, or much of a model either. My mom was totally useless in a crisis, so I took over early. It really is totally beside the point as far as the topic's concerned though as Yash isn't talking at all about whether 'self'' is good or bad.
If one turns their focus to the Ordinary things in life that we pay no mind, instead of all the extraordinary things our minds are beset with, one can find they can get in touch with their actual reality by living in the moment, instead of anticipated moments.
I have to admit it, I'm one of the most guilty of that around. We do spend most of our lives on autopilot, not particularly thinking about what we're doing at the moment, or even how we're feeling, but how we will feel, will think and will act. And the difference really IS huge. It's like the difference betwdeen being in love - fully experiencing a person and an emotion, breathing it all in and savoring it, as opposed to the mundane; doing things mindlessly with little or no attention, and virtually no real involvement. It might be part of the 'risk-taking' behavior - the only way to really feel alive, after losing the ability to be in the moment. I try to be mindful of it, but that can only be when I'm not multitasking, the curse of modern life, which is impossible to do if you're not thinking about what you need to do next. But some of my most compelling memories are silly little things - watching a shaft of sunlight breaking through a mist, when I was six years old, to spending an hour lying in the grass watching an ant stun a worm and pull it out of its hole.
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| Jan 16 @ 2:23 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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carpediem48
Posts: 3,138
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Yash,,
Could you condense the OP for me
How are you integrating the 'concept that "What you believe,is not whathat you are'?
The title of the thread caught my attention but
I found myself unable to 
sort thru your OP without using 'assumption' ,,,,which I try to avoid
especially when it reflects negatively on others
[Edited on 1/16/2008 2:31 AM]
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| Jan 16 @ 8:22 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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Carp, Heaven I believe gets it. But some of my most compelling memories are silly little things - watching a shaft of sunlight breaking through a mist, when I was six years old, to spending an hour lying in the grass watching an ant stun a worm and pull it out of its hole.
The Ordinary things in life are where the beauty and joy in life are that one can connect too, but most of the time are ignored for the Extraordinary. Something as simple as Stop and smell the roses, hear your ears hearing, and being aware we were programmed from birth to think we are an Ego, ID or persona that is separate an apart from external things.
The above post has nothing to do with Religion although Bev thinks it does. If one carefully reads the words it's points to from the instant of birth, right to the present we have let others define us internally, and define objects and subjects external to us as well. So we see by rules society has defined for us as important, when in reality society points to the extraordinary not the ordinary.
So our Ego and I was defined by others externally. To open ones eyes is to find there is no I, there is a oneness where you are a part of all that exist on Earth as well as all that there is.
If one can learn to accept this then it is a plus not a minus when one takes it to any form of belief system. Put another way this is about getting the most out of life and your place in it in the here and now, while letting any form of belief system about an after life take care of that. Religions focus on the here and now are about rules that one must follow to be accepted in a afterlife. They are not pointing you to the fact that you are one with all that there is now.
That is what I am addressing. "What you believe, is not what you are, Unless you turn to the Ordinary in daily moments and realize every moment in life is a NOW moment, neither past nor present, are present in a NOW moment. So if you accept that all things are one and connected is that contrary to any religion? I think not.
[Edited on 1/16/2008 8:28 AM]
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| Jan 16 @ 10:45 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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Wow, I have extraordinary things happening daily, yash, and I love it. Simple things in times of reflection are great, but the extraordinary are simply that, extraordinary and wonderful. We stop and smell the roses when we are too tied up in work things and unpleasurable things, not when we are in the midst of the extraordinary.
Stop and smell the roses means to rest a little and observe the beautiful things of nature instead of working ourselves to death. When you are in the midst of the extraordinary, they just add extra dimension, are super brilliant, become a part of it.
[Edited on 1/16/2008 10:47 AM]
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| Jan 16 @ 10:46 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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carpediem48
Posts: 3,138
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Wow,,,,ok,,,,could you do that more often,,,why was that so clear this time and it,,,,ahem,,,,did 'RESOUND',,,EXCEPT OF COURSE FOR one little itty bitty reference which was a little itty bitty distracting
A sincere thanx Yash  ,,,I appreciate you taking the time
Did you give me the kindergarten version,,,well if you did that's ok,,,,I remember it being said that all we ever needed to know we learned in kindergarten
I was on my way out of here
when I saw your response to my request for clarification
Now I'm going to quit while I'm ahead and still have good feelings 
[Edited on 1/16/2008 10:49 AM]
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| Jan 16 @ 10:48 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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It is that but it also reflects by observing nature at work we can see we are a part of nature and depend on nature for our very existence. We are one with nature and one with all that there is.
All we ever needed to know is what we did not have embedded in us by others after conception, now that is the kindergarten version!
[Edited on 1/16/2008 10:52 AM]
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| Jan 16 @ 10:52 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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I have trouble understanding him, too, carp. I love that quote, thank you. I have to read through his posts two or three or four times sometimes. Lol, then he wonders why I just skim them sometimes. I understand them just as well by skimming them as reading them. Sorry, yash. Really, keep it everyday, common, normal, everyday wording and English. That is what makes a good writer. I know I could understand it better that way. The other stuff is just what I told you it was earlier.
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| Jan 16 @ 10:53 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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By the way, yash, in answer to a past post. Christians are IN this world but not OF it.
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| Jan 16 @ 10:55 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are....
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,639
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I really am sorry for your inadequate education, or ability to process any intellectual information. Perhaps a speed reading course along with comprehension test to determine what you really understood is in order.
Oh yes you are not real only a figment of our imagination so you are not of this world, well that certainly explains a lot doesn't it?
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| Jan 16 @ 11:01 AM |
What you believe, is not what you are.... |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,144
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My education is quite adequate, yash, adequate enough to know that anyone who wants their writing to be read and enjoyed should write in simple, common English and make themselves very clear. I had very good English teachers.
Your phrasing and wording reminds me of that cosmic awareness stuff that I studied and got in the mail years ago. Obtuse, and while seeming to be intelligent and having much to say, said very little and was false.
The language and wording of
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