| May 12, 2008 @ 8:16 AM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
12knots
Posts: 6,400
|
Most religions require converts to exist. Members have a need to go out and convert people. Christianity requires the word of the lord to be spread to others.
Well, many others dont need it or require it.
It should be made against the law to solicitate converts!!!! Especially to walk up garden paths, knocking on the door and disturbing the peace!
|
|
  |
|
| May 12, 2008 @ 9:40 AM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
hammertime
Posts: 14,071
|
Yeah, its called no trespassing.
I think in Texas, the law allows you to shoot first and ask questions later.
|
| |
|
| May 12, 2008 @ 10:01 AM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
eastham
Posts: 7,907
|
Wow, should we close Tibet House?
And this from Wiki:
Some scholars, such as Charles Prebish, have suggested that the social phenomenon of Buddhism in America can be seen to be comprised of three broad types. The oldest and largest of these is "immigrant" or "ethnic Buddhism", those Buddhist traditions that arrived in America along with immigrants who were already believers and that largely remained with those immigrants and their descendants. The next oldest and arguably the most visible and best-heralded type is referred to as "import Buddhism", because it came to America largely in response to the demand of interested American converts who sought it out, either by going abroad or by supporting foreign teachers; this is sometimes also called "elite Buddhism" because its practitioners, especially early in the process, tended to come from social elites. The newest trend in Buddhism is "export" or "evangelical Buddhism", groups which are based in another country and who are actively recruiting members in America from various backgrounds; by far the most successful of these has been Soka Gakkai, which will be discussed below.
|
|
| |
|
| May 12, 2008 @ 12:15 PM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
12knots
Posts: 6,400
|
East, I dare say the influence of American culture will sway pure Buddhism as all cultures have done so since Buddhism began.
Wonder what it will be called?
|
| |
|
| May 12, 2008 @ 10:29 PM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
j_goose
Posts: 2,911
|
Wiki........ 
|
|
| |
|
| May 14, 2008 @ 8:46 AM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
12knots
Posts: 6,400
|
Wow, should we close Tibet House?
Historically and in the true practice of Buddhism, conversion is not an option.
On record the Buddha is the only religious spiritual head that has said quite categorically:
"don't follow me, because I'm Buddha,
don't follow me, because somebody tells you to"
Buddhism has always survived as the Dharma teachings of the Buddha because of its own merits, its truths.
All other religions have required "spreading the word" and conversion often through fear. I dare say if it wasnt for this fact many of these religions would have faded away.
Ultimately man will have to follow truth if he is to progress on the spiritual path There is no other way at all, nada, zip, zilch!
|
| |
|
| May 14, 2008 @ 9:13 AM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
hammertime
Posts: 14,071
|
Thats a big point.
Q) Why would a religion that is filled with truth, wisdom, hope, salvation need to be force upon you?
A) Because its not filled with truth, wisdom, hope and salvation.
Its the natural inclination of healthy people to survival and to thrive. Its human nature for people to join together and desire good things and be happy. A philosophy that offers this wouldn't need to be forced upon anyone.
|
|
| |
|
| May 15, 2008 @ 2:57 PM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
12knots
Posts: 6,400
|
Q) Why would a religion that is filled with truth, wisdom, hope, salvation need to be force upon you?
A) Because its not filled with truth, wisdom, hope and salvation.
Reminds me of the persons who boast about what they can do when applying for emplyment yet when emploed fail miserably at the task.
"Before telling the world what you can do, first show the world what you can do!"
|
| |
|
| May 15, 2008 @ 3:21 PM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
LanceVarden7
Posts: 1,092
|
It should be made against the law to solicitate converts!!!! Especially to walk up garden paths, knocking on the door and disturbing the peace! I agree to an extent.I visited a Baptist Church in Florida once. A few days later, one evening, I was having a cookout with firemds from out of town. In the middle of the meal, there was a knock at the door. Two dressed up couples with bibles in hand wanting to come and do a bible service. I apologized at first, assuming it was an appointment I had forgotten. they said "No, were just out and around dropping in here and there to find fellowship" Mind you, I did not know this people AT ALL. It was a huge church, and I guess it was a common practice to pull with visitors. I called the church to complain and we never went there again.
|
|
| |
|
| May 15, 2008 @ 3:37 PM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
12knots
Posts: 6,400
|
Hey, Lance, great to see you back!!!!
I had no idea the baptists did this sort of thing too. 
Good for you in complaining. That has given me an idea too.... to get the Church of the people that keep calling around here on Saturdays and complain.
|
| |
|
| May 15, 2008 @ 6:15 PM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
uab_5
Posts: 4,759
|
All followers are all called to serve Him as He serves us.
We expected to share the Good News when appropiate and witness to those who have not heard about Christ.
That being said, I find the true path to witnessing to some one is not by telling them about Christ, but rather by showing them what Christ has done for me.
How?
I've go into poor areas of my community and serve the needy food or build them a computer lab. I am going next month to Costa Rica to build a church in a rural area.
Let them witness the miracles first hand.
Then they will ask why I serve, so I will tell why.
Yes, it does upset me to no end when the Jehovah Witnesses climb my driveway to say:
Knock, knock, sh*t happens!
Bak to the OP: why follow a religion?
Because lack of faith, is too a faith. Is not an empty cup still filled with air?
God bless and Good luck.
|
|
| |
|
| May 15, 2008 @ 8:00 PM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
hammertime
Posts: 14,071
|
All followers are all called to serve Him as He serves us. Serve what? Hors d'oeuvres?
We expected to share the Good News when appropiate and witness to those who have not heard about Christ. Who decides what is appropriate and who hasn't heard about Christianity in the 21st Century? You have to be living on a deserted island not to.
Let them witness the miracles first hand. A real miracle worth witnessing would be for televangelists to disappear and churches tax free status to go away.
Because lack of faith, is too a faith. Is not an empty cup still filled with air? And using that logic would mean 0 = 1. And empty cup could be filled with nothing too, a vacuum, that would make it empty.
|
| |
|
| May 15, 2008 @ 10:23 PM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
Angel54214
Posts: 18,175
|
Wonder what it will be called?
I believe it was already called in the New World America; it was the "Gold Rush Kamma" of 1849!  
|
|
| |
|
| May 16, 2008 @ 12:15 AM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
ServantOfChrist2
Posts: 7,434
|
Good post uab_5. I couldn't agree with you more.
With such an attitude, armed with a bit of boldness; I'm certain that your life is familiar with the Peace produced by His love. 
|
| |
|
| May 16, 2008 @ 12:28 AM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
uab_5
Posts: 4,759
|
Thanks SOC
All followers are all called to serve Him as He serves us.
Serve what? Hors d'oeuvres?
Serve as in give SERVICE TO.
We expected to share the Good News when appropiate and witness to those who have not heard about Christ.
Who decides what is appropriate and who hasn't heard about Christianity in the 21st Century? You have to be living on a deserted island not to.
I said
when appropiate
Not where appropiate.
And there is a huge difference between hearing about Christ with your ears vs hearing about Christ with your heart.
Only when one is poor in spirit can they truly hear the Good News.
Let them witness the miracles first hand.
A real miracle worth witnessing would be for televangelists to disappear and churches tax free status to go away.
AMEN! If they preach on TV, ignore them.
Because lack of faith, is too a faith. Is not an empty cup still filled with air?
And using that logic would mean 0 = 1. And empty cup could be filled with nothing too, a vacuum, that would make it empty
You're incorrect. In algebra, the null set is still a set of zero elements and thus can be defined.
An atheist has just a strict code, religion, or whatever as a head banging Muslim.
[Edited on 5/16/2008 12:37 AM]
|
|
| |
|
| May 16, 2008 @ 12:14 PM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
hammertime
Posts: 14,071
|
Serve as in give SERVICE TO. To what with what? You seen no reason to help a fellow human or animal unless its a religious mission?
And there is a huge difference between hearing about Christ with your ears vs hearing about Christ with your heart. You can not hear anything with your heart. It a pump to pump blood. That statement has no meaning other than some kind of emotional plea.
Having no faith means no faith. Thats what the no means. Yet everyone has faith. I have faith when I'm in a situation I have little or no control over such as driving my car on a highway. I can control my car but I can not control road conditions or other drivers. Its a combination of faith, trust and wishes. Its very much like gambling which, of course, is probabilities and statistics. Ask any insurance actuary. The only way you can better your odds is controlling what you can better. No magic there. Religious faith is about magic however and thats worse than gambling because there is no indication of winning or losing other than pure belief and where the prize is delivered after you're dead.
|
| |
|
| May 17, 2008 @ 10:31 AM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
eastham
Posts: 7,907
|
I think this thread is more a question of definition than anything else. The OP narrowly defines religion and conversion and in doing so thinks he has exempting his own belief system and its practice from both.
Knotts, you can narrowly define religion as to exempt Buddhism from it, but know that you are flying in the face of how religion is defined by most social scientists. Sociologists, anthropologists and others consider Buddhism to be a religion, even in the absence of a transcendant being and in the individuality of practice. Lindbeck in his Nature of Doctrine defines religion as a:
"a kind of cultural and/or linguistic framework or medium that shapes the entirety of life and thought… it is similar to an idiom that makes possible the description of realities, the formulation of beliefs, and the experiencing of inner attitudes, feelings, and sentiments.”
Therefore Buddhism is not simply a personal philosphy, but in fact a religion. The fact that there are rituals, holy books, monks, etc further underminds the efforts to pretend Buddhists are not adherent of an actual religion, but of some other construct. This is splitting hairs.
Secondly, I believe that in the OP you confuse conversion and proselytizing. Every religion accepts converts, even the Jews, which forbid proselytizing. What becomes obnoxious is the notion of some that they must be in your face, invading your space and constantly evangelizing. Indeed, the more these people are loathed by their co-workers and their fellow man, the better they feel. This type of behavior can be seen on city streets as well as here on MD.
That said, there are far more discreet and in my view more effective methods of encouragement. I previously mentioned Tibet House. Tibet House does not limit itself to cultural programming about Tibet, but is a platform for educational programs about Tibetan and other types of Buddhism. In theory and in practice, individuals who do not self-identify as Buddhists could attend these programs and ultimately come to believe that the practice of Buddhism speaks to them. You cannot convince me that is a coincidence and that the board and officers of Tibet Hosue do not or would not welcome any new adherent of Buddhism that comes to the practice, because of his/her exposure to programming at Tibet House.
|
|
| |
|
| May 17, 2008 @ 10:42 AM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
12knots
Posts: 6,400
|
Eastham,
I think you are intellectualizing far too much and finding issues where none lay in reference to the OP.
|
| |
|
| May 17, 2008 @ 3:52 PM |
Why follow a religion?
|
|
eastham
Posts: 7,907
|
No, I don't think I'm "intellectualizing too much."
In your original post, you advocate a ban on the solicitation of converts, yet how those individuals are solicited remains undefined, except to make it seem that only Christian sects seek out coverts. The process of seeking out converts can vary from sect to sect and individual to individual, and no religious practice does not seek new members through conversion. While some Jewish posters may chime in and say "we don't", I have seen Hasidim on Fifth Avenue openly prosyletize individuals they thought were fellow Jews.
|
|
| |
|
| May 17, 2008 @ 4:27 PM |
Why follow a religion? |
|
12knots
Posts: 6,400
|
So why didn't you say this and be to the point instead of the other verbose posting mainly on the aims to imply Buddhism is a culprit towards "garden path conversionism."
|
| |
|
|
|
|