| May 30 @ 1:29 AM |
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Angel54214
Posts: 14,074
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"Servant" I apologize for not contributing to your OP. So I am first quoting what your intpretation of Jesus' parable of the lost son:
In this story told by Jesus, we are shown God's amazing love. He is the father character in the story.
We are shown that His faithful, amazing love embraces all who choose to seek Him. Regardless of their story.
I agree this story of the Father, is a resemblence of God the Father. When a young adult leaves his own Father and goes off into the wide wide world, he leaves behind not just his Father, but all that his Father gives him; the love, adoration. The ordinances to keep him on a straight path as he grows, the memories that time had built between them and all the hopes and dreams that builds a joyful life. The treasures that can not be found in a box or trunk. The treasures that do not rust or rot.
This son was as like being dead to the Father. They became separated and for how long, the story does not say. When a child leaves us, we feel a large part of us has died within us. A life part that does not currently exist any longer. It is painful and brings the sorrow of emptyness that stirs the soul that abounds in fullness.
When his son returned, we see how he already was prepared to tell his Father of the sins he did. In other words, the son repented to his Father; pouring out all the bad things he had done.
The Father knowing his son was a faroff, but had the hope of his return, for he missed all the "true treasures" they once had and shared together, that upon his return, they would reunite in those treasures again.
The older son, not ever probably experiencing this, did not know what would have been missed, for he never was lost to miss.
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| May 30 @ 1:31 AM |
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hunt4luv
Posts: 1,234
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What we need to see is though he was a long way off he was headed back in the direction of his fathers house.
Soc sadly we live in a world where people want to believe they have no responsibility for their actions. Salvation requires us to understand the need for salvation. Once the need is seen Then repentance and welcoming Gods spirit into our hearts is the next step.
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| May 30 @ 1:43 AM |
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Angel54214
Posts: 14,074
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What we need to see is though he was a long way off he was headed back in the direction of his fathers house.
Yes Hunt, that is in the story also... 
When he came to his senses--So he got up and went to his father.
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| May 30 @ 1:44 AM |
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loisday
Posts: 1,333
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Exactly!!! The very simple fact of the turn towards home was all that was needed to cause the Father to RUN towards his child. The child did not fall at his Father's feet with shame and guilt He did nothing more than turn towards home.............The Father RUNS to meet him. No questions asked. The Father is wise. He knew what the return to home was all about. That simple turn told it all. His grace is boundless.........it doesn't require us to live in shame..............His Love is so amazing..........it frees us. There is no condemnation. There is only acceptance of us...........in all of our humanity. Actually the Father is always there..................waiting...............even before I return home. From grace to grace...forever.
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| May 30 @ 2:09 AM |
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Angel54214
Posts: 14,074
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| May 30 @ 7:14 AM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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Lois,
When he was a long way off...............before he ever came face to face with his earthy Father.......before he could even ask for forgiveness......to promise to and prove to change his ways...........His Father RAN to meet him....No questions asked.............no shame applied......no finger pointing bashing...........His Father welcomed him home with open arms. Of course, his brothe{ could be seen as brother in Christ too} was in the background...bitching. Yeah, but he did this.......he didn't do that...shame, shame, shame....finger pointing....saying how much of a "better" " obedient" son he was!!!!!!
So too, does Christ/God run to us. He meets us where we are...........without condemnation..........without shame or threats and fear. His Love has only open arms and welcome...............without conditions.
Great Post! 
It is obvious where your heart is. 
Peace
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| May 30 @ 7:55 AM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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Hunt,
What we need to see is though he was a long way off he was headed back in the direction of his fathers house.
Soc sadly we live in a world where people want to believe they have no responsibility for their actions. Salvation requires us to understand the need for salvation. Once the need is seen Then repentance and welcoming Gods spirit into our hearts is the next step.
As I said (in my following post to Angel), you are a great example of a christian acting like the older son. Unable to accept that your heavenly father would unconditionally welcome even nonbelievers. No need to repent. No need to accept conditions. No need to "Choose you this day".
What christians fail to see is that the father saw his son in the distance. He didn't know if his son was returning for good, just visiting or just taking a nature walk. The father ran to him, the father returned to his son. The father didn't give the son a chance to be humbled before him, but immediately placed his son on a platform.
As Jesus said:Luke 15
4What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?
5And when he hath found it, he layeth it on his shoulders, rejoicing.
6And when he cometh home, he calleth together his friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost.
Notice that the emphasis is on the sheep being found that is important. Not that the sheep had to want to return. Not that the sheep had to repent and appologize for having left and cause the shepherd to loose hours searching for it. When the sheep is found the shepherd lifts up the sheep and carries it on his shoulders. The sheep didn't even have to follow the shepherd. The shepherd knew what was best for the sheep and did what had to be done, no questions asked.
Peace
[Edited on 5/30/2008 8:13 AM]
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| May 30 @ 7:59 AM |
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sealacamp
Posts: 3,154
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The child did not fall at his Father's feet with shame and guilt
"The son said to him, 'Father, I have sinned against heaven and against you. I am no longer worthy to be called your son.
There is an expression of shame and guilt and a confession of sin in this statement which is part of the story and also part of our proper response to God once the lights have come on that is.
S
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| May 30 @ 8:11 AM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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Angel,
For some reason my post to you didn't take.
You posted:The older son, not ever probably experiencing this, did not know what would have been missed, for he never was lost to miss.
Another good post!
I'd like to expand on the older son's symbolism.
It is almost like Jesus was prophesying about future christians. The older son (as christians today) couldn't accept the fact that the father would unconditionally welcome the lost (nonbelieving) son with open arms without need for the lost son (nonbeliever) to do anything. The older son (believers) expected to be treated better than the lost son, expected rewards for his loyalty. He considered the lost son to be inferior and expected his father to recognize this. The son, however, had no idea of his father's unconditional love of his lost son, and was surprised at his father's unconditional love and joy at just finding his lost son.
Peace
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| May 30 @ 8:30 AM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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Seal,
There is an expression of shame and guilt and a confession of sin in this statement which is part of the story and also part of our proper response to God once the lights have come on that is.
The father had already accepted his lost son with open arms. His son said this but based on the parable it was not necessary. When the lost son realized that his father unconditionally welcomed him home, he experienced his father's love like the elder son never could. He then from his own heart humbled himself before his father. He was basically saying "Father you have unconditionaly welcomed me back into the family even though I am not worthy to be called your son".
Peace
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| May 30 @ 8:34 AM |
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sealacamp
Posts: 3,154
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No sail that is not what he said. You spin the words to suit you as usual. He repented and returned and then confessed. His repentance was all that was truly needed yet he confessed even though nothing was asked of him. The father did not find the son, the son returned to the father. The father sought the sons return and looked for him until the day he returned. His point of watch was his abode. It never ceases to amaze me how you just can't accept the words as written but have to extrapolate upon them to make them suit you better.
S
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| May 30 @ 9:01 AM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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Seal,
Are you saying that if the son was just traveling past his father's property and glanced at it only because it represented his past life but with no sorrow and repentance in his heart, that the father upon seeing him would have acted differently?
Are you saying that the father, through a mind link, heard his son's repentance and for that reason only, ran to his son?
This parable gives the same message as the Lost Sheep parable. The shepherd (the father) searches for the lost sheep (the lost son) and rejoices when he finds him.
Your dogma taints god's unconditional love for his creation.
Peace
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| May 30 @ 9:39 AM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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Christians obviously do not underatand the parables we have been discussing.
If Jesus adheared to christian dogma, his parable about the lost sheep would have been more in the line of the following:
"What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, would waste his time looking for the one and not attend to the others which may run away without your guidance? Reward the "ninety and nine" for they alone humble themselves before you.
Eventually the lost one will become hungry and thirsty, It will return with it's tail between it's legs; seeking the food and water you can provide. But do not provide for it's needs in haste. It must be trained to recognize your dominance over it; repent for it's mistake; and humble itself before you.
By doing this you show the "ninety and nine" what will happen to them if they decide to question your dominance over them.
If the lost sheep returns and refuses to repent and worship you, the shepherd, chase it away otherwise you will be seen as weak in the eyes of the other sheep in the flock.
If the lost sheep never returns, there is no loss since it didn't deserve your attention anyway. Sheep that act like that produce poor wool and their chops are know to be tough. A shepherd should only be concerned with sheep with the finest wool and the sweetest, jucy chops."
Peace
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| May 30 @ 9:53 AM |
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Angel54214
Posts: 14,074
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One thing I forgot to add, was the Israelites upon the death of the Father his will was told before his last breath to his family. The prosperites would be divided to his siblings. In this story, the youngest son already claiming his prosperity, acknowleges in his own mind that his Father would become dead since he was leaving and most likely had no mind set of returning to see him again.
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| May 30 @ 11:29 AM |
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sealacamp
Posts: 3,154
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Are you saying that if the son was just traveling past his father's property and glanced at it only because it represented his past life but with no sorrow and repentance in his heart, that the father upon seeing him would have acted differently?
A perfect display of a severe comprehensional deficit!
S
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| May 30 @ 12:05 PM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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Seal,
It was a question. How about answering it? 
Peace
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| May 30 @ 12:45 PM |
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ServantOfChrist2
Posts: 4,180
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I think what sealacamp is implying is that all that is required of us, in order to receive the free gift of eternal life, is a very simple one-time procedure.
But our response for having received this amazing gift is something else again.
While nothing else is required of us. We cannot lose our salvation: salvation is a gift.
But our gratitude should be such that we feel compelled to offer the Father much of ourselves.
Salvation is a gift.
Salvation is a gift.
Salvation is a gift.
And in this case, the gift came at an awful price: His life.
(But it is not a price that any of us will ever have to pay. He paid it all for us.)
As a child were you given everything your little heart desired Sail?
Do you have any appreciation for gifts Sail? Or are gifts just things to be expected?
Some people acknowledge that Salvation + Eternal Life are not something a right of all human beings. You've told us many times that everybody lives forever.
But some of us believe otherwise.
In essence you do not acknowledge salvation. You believe you have not been saved from anything. You believe you would have lived forever regardless of anything Christ ever did. As a result you should not have any gratitude. 
At which place in my reasoning was I incorrect?
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| May 30 @ 12:54 PM |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,601
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SOC,
Ramble, ramble, ramble.
All that and you still did not answer the question. The question had to do with Jesus' parables.
Peace
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| May 30 @ 12:56 PM |
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hammertime
Posts: 14,071
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Salvation is a gift.
Salvation is a gift.
Salvation is a gift.
And in this case, the gift came at an awful price: His life. Seems he couldn't save himself...
Wow!!! Look that this...
SOC Filled with Spirit
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LDxbhgmk3VE
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| May 31 @ 2:24 AM |
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hunt4luv
Posts: 1,234
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Seal Thanks again for once again posting the truth in the face of the lie that was misrepresenting it. God Bless you Brother.
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