| Aug 11 @ 7:00 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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j_goose
Posts: 1,951
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Ok, bud, time to show what you got stocked on your shelves.
Prove you exist.
While we're at it, hey J.C.!!! YOU prove YOU exist!
Let's go!!!
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| Aug 11 @ 8:10 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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hammertime
Posts: 14,071
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What? Leave me alone. I'm busy.
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| Aug 11 @ 8:10 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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j_goose
Posts: 1,951
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Sorry sorry. I was talking to the god of Abraham....
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| Aug 11 @ 8:12 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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hammertime
Posts: 14,071
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He's in rehab. Very screwed up guy, tells people to kill their sons and he winds up killing his own.
Right now he's heavily medicated which is why no one heard from him in a while.
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| Aug 11 @ 8:41 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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j_goose
Posts: 1,951
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Well, wat about Jesus? I assume he's been told to clean his room. Dad must have gotten mad that he took away Mosiac law and trashed the Old Testament.
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| Aug 11 @ 9:39 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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j_goose
Posts: 1,951
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Well, here's the update.
We're waiting on god to answer a few prayers.
According to Bev,
come on, guys, if He is not real, your prayer won't be answered, then you have more ammunition.
Waiting waiting.
Don't see what te big deal would be for god and J.C. to just show themselves.
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| Aug 11 @ 11:27 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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Angel54214
Posts: 13,932
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Just for observation purposes...For the prosecutor to accuse the crimes God committed, the prosecutor would have to believe God exists and know who and where he is. Without a convict, the crime goes unsolved and ends up in the X files!
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| Aug 11 @ 11:29 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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uncrazy
Posts: 1,489
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Hammer & j_goose,
I'm sure you realize you are presenting in this thread as agnostics if you seek proof.
This thread is useful for it confronts the idea that god exists external to man at any time. The christian faith presents a strategy where this can happen, and then labors to deal with this crisis. Even with the book saying the kingdom is found within us, they have an Armeggedon that will finally establish the kingdom for good.
In this Armeggedon, the god of unlimited love for His creation gets to finally kick butt with justice...never mind that justice of God is said to be perfectly balnce with his unlimited mercy, both deriving out of His nature of love.
Only man in his imagination can reduce these aspects of God Himself to get God to behave like humans do.
The current ideas about heaven and hell show both to be lockdowns for the ego, with one more pleasant than the other. Our current sense of self gets to continue living and gets to retain the memory of who we were and how we got there.
We got more work to do...don't worry, we have all the time in the world(even though they have found red cows in both Isreal and the US), we are all looking at a common illusion, and we have only one destination for all... a single point we have forgotten...and even it doesn't exist outside of All That Is and All That Isn't.
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| Aug 11 @ 11:37 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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Angel54214
Posts: 13,932
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I liked that post Uncrazy...  We know there was a "past", we know there is a "present", but we don't know there is a "future"; the former remains ever a "mystery".
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| Aug 11 @ 11:46 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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j_goose
Posts: 1,951
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Just for observation purposes...For the prosecutor to accuse the crimes God committed, the prosecutor would have to believe God exists and know who and where he is. Without a convict, the crime goes unsolved and ends up in the X files!
The point I've presented all along is that god is a myth. All those who "believe" have no proof of this supposed diety, nor their savior.
Not one piece of evidence.
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| Aug 11 @ 11:57 PM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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Angel54214
Posts: 13,932
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This is true goose, and is the way to be, just like it is the way to be there is no proof of non-existance. Just like Love...we can't prove it's existance nor prove it's non-existance. No shovel will find it...no sea will drown it. But there are those that believe it exist and there are those that believe it doesn't.
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| Aug 12 @ 12:33 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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uncrazy
Posts: 1,489
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j_goose,
The point I've presented all along is that god is a myth. All those who "believe" have no proof of this supposed diety, nor their savior.
Good points,
I like to consider it this way...there is a God, but not easily imagined by a mind as small as man's, and because of that little problem, difficult to describe.
Wtihout any knowledge of history, the bible story can present as a marvelous tale that can't be proved or disproved. It won't even appear as a myth without the history.
Add the history in and the myths become too heavy for even Jesus to carry, so he will shed them, and we will be left with the real story the myths were designed to conceal and carry to us.
I mentioned earlier that the whole NT is written in a form of a parable and showed an earlier example of the form over data not identified as a parable. It is something I have come to see, I used to think you could take the parables out to study them...now taking the parable out we have no words to look at. As a writer this must make sense to you.
I first saw this in when correspondents with me would venture into writing a story like Von Daaniken did in Out of Africa. We began it with "once upon a time", pass it and the other would set the backround for the story, the pass it. We created some interesting stories, but they became more intense and compelling when we agreed to write our action piece of the story, then underlay what was going in our minds and feelings that disn't get said when we had written the action part. It can knock you down. You can fall in love really hard and quickly in this fantasy style.
In a similiar manner you can't take the miraclles out to study them and they have a second deeper meaning if we only re-find the Jewish history.
I think we will find the names of the contemporary writers you seek in Acts and Revelations...I have said these guys wrote us a story so it couldn't be missed even when they look bad, and they will. But when we see this we will see the truth they offered in clear light and we will understand what and why they have done it.
They identified a problem, and gave us a solution even the church couldn't lose. The idea that we are lost sheep make more sense than we give it, for until we learn what they wrote in words underneath the parable, we will remain lost sheep.
For a while yet we will hear that we are lost and they are found...we are just the first people to say we are all lost. The truth will set us free, but it can piss us off bad, because it is frightening to let go of myths of long standing.
We will see the full instructions of how to find the kingdom within, and will have on earth as it is in heaven. We will see the myths and know they were put there so they could be found.
I would guess we will pull this off in the next 200-400 years if we plug along...some say trudging the road to happy destiny.
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| Aug 12 @ 12:42 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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uncrazy
Posts: 1,489
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Angel54,
We walk a similiar path, and our tasks are interlinked. Your views provide a certain type of ordering to my thinking and new search paths. We may even discuss points that seem to others we are far apart on, but we both seem to be searching in the same dark closet, coming up with socks that are missing the other so we can have a pair of them after we find enough socks.
I love metaphors...another device for layering ideas over one another.
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| Aug 12 @ 12:57 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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Angel54214
Posts: 13,932
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yes so true! For me I'd like to mold that dark closet into a dark maze, for there's always an opening for a way out as well as the endured adventure that leads to it. I chose not to fear, but rather peacefully enjoy the journey.
As this I see was so of the God of Abraham, for he came unanouncing himself by any name, but saved the introduction at a later time for a festival service of the sons.
[Edited on 8/12/2008 1:08 AM]
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| Aug 12 @ 1:13 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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uncrazy
Posts: 1,489
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Angel54,
...endured adventure ...
I sense the meaning of "jihad" a struggle almost...the meaning the ladies clarified for me in the earlier thread on Islam.
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| Aug 12 @ 1:23 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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Angel54214
Posts: 13,932
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Maybe an exchange of holy books would become a treaty that both can understand the meaning of love thy neighbor. But only if they agree to meet at the Arabian Nome of Goshen in the wilderness of Zoan. ~ jashima! ~
[Edited on 8/12/2008 1:31 AM]
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| Aug 12 @ 1:45 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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hammertime
Posts: 14,071
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Just like Love...we can't prove it's existance nor prove it's non-existance. Maybe you never had love or shown it.
Love is an emotion that you know how you feel. Someone else will know it when you express it. God doesn't exist to anyone if there is no expression. Love doesn't' exist for the same reasons. It doesn't matter what you feel if it can't be expressed. Its as good as not existing at all.
Supposedly God is not an emotion but a being that should be able to express emotions. There is no evidence, no proof, no veracity, no fact, no anything on such a creature existing. Even if it did exist, it remains hidden and unknown just like unicorns and leprechauns. All anyone can do is write fables about what they think exists. The bible is that book. All the other stuff is just setting.
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| Aug 12 @ 1:53 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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hammertime
Posts: 14,071
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Only man in his imagination can reduce these aspects of God Himself to get God to behave like humans do. The only behavior is what's written in a book. It depicts god to be more evil than a devil. Its a man made invention like all the rest, 3000 approximately.
My favorite definition of God is written by Joseph Campbell.
"God is a metaphor for that which transcends all levels of intellectual thought".
Not only can't you talk about this god but you can't even think about it. Brilliant definition but kills the god of Abraham because that a god of human construction with human characteristics and a human personality. Campbell used to talk about the God beyond God which is God's God, a transcendent god outside of it all.
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| Aug 12 @ 2:17 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!!
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uncrazy
Posts: 1,489
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Hammer,
I too like Campbell's idea of metaphor.
I can see why the buddhist try to live by the paths and tenets. They would not be troubled by Campbell's words. I'm not sure they would rise to the idea of transcendancy named God's God, but that the metaphor would transcend all intellectual thought would seem in my mind not to trouble them at all.
16knots or BandTmom can clarify these fine points for us.
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| Aug 12 @ 2:27 AM |
Hey GOD!!! Prove You Exist!!! |
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hammertime
Posts: 14,071
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Un
No it wouldn't trouble the Buddhists but it would the three dogmas of Abraham because all claim, especially Islam and Christianity, to know God, what he thinks, wants, etc. These so called clergy claim authority, ability and to know ultimate truth. Judaism may also have the same claims but they don't make a lot of noise about it.
I don't see these as spiritual systems, they are legal and caste systems that use the backdrop of spirituality as means to hypnotize and entrance the masses, the sheeples into believing they are getting all of reality ministered to them.
I have no problem with a concept of God that is a word that represents all things known and unknown as a means to conveniently sum all that up into a single syllable. Even that is not transcendent enough.
Eastern thought is very comfortable with the unknown and so is science. I see why the two like each other. They seem to compliment one another. That place called Void is where one resides when he transcends all the other levels or elements.
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