| Aug 21 @ 6:33 AM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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You guys might like this one to chew on. I find it very informative and contains the description of what Jesus looked like and the way others thought of him.
http://www.thenazareneway.com/likeness_of_our_saviour.htm
Very interesting, contains lots of different descriptions of Him.
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| Aug 21 @ 8:15 AM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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You guys want to discuss the emerald of Caesar with the likeness of Jesus carved on it. From all I can find, it is authentic, and proves that Jesus existed.
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| Aug 21 @ 8:51 AM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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16knots
Posts: 3,627
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More BS!
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| Aug 21 @ 9:29 AM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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Prove it, knotts.
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| Aug 21 @ 9:53 AM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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16knots
Posts: 3,627
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Prove what?
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| Aug 21 @ 9:59 AM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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hammertime
Posts: 14,071
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Jesus has no historical evidence. No actual witness wrote about him. Thats a fact.
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| Aug 21 @ 11:45 AM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,495
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Bev,
Great site. I'm glad that you reccommended it to R&S members.
It contains much information that rebuts your sick christian dogma.
Try this from the same Essene site you reccommended:The Jesus bloodline theory has become famous through the works The Holy Blood and the Holy Grail, the book by Michael Baigent, Richard Leigh, and Henry Lincoln, which was based on Pierre Plantard's Priory of Sion, and The Da Vinci Code by Dan Brown which closely follows the theory, presenting it as the basis for a fictional drama involving catholic conspiracy.
These authors further asserted that the ultimate goals of the Priory of Sion are:
Founding a "Holy European Empire" that would become the next hyperpower and usher in a new world order of peace and prosperity;
Establishing a messianic mystery state religion by revealing the Holy Grail, which would prove Ebionite views and Desposyni claims; and
Grooming and installing a "Rex Deus" on the throne of a Greater Israel.
The Theory
The main elements of the theory are that:
Jesus had a child, probably a daughter, with Mary Magdalene, with whom he was married.
The descendants of this child became the Merovingian kings of France.
The Church has suppressed the truth about Mary Magdalene and the Jesus bloodline for 2000 years. This is principally because they fear the power of the sacred feminine, which they have demonized as Satanic.
A secret order protects these royal claimants because they may be the literal descendants of Jesus and his wife, Mary Magdalene, or, at the very least, of King David and the High Priest Aaron.
This secret society known as Priory of Sion has a long and illustrious history dating back to the First Crusade starting with the creation of the Knights Templar as its military and financial front.
The Priory is led by a Grand Master or Nautonnier. It is devoted to returning the Merovingian dynasty, that ruled the Frankish kingdom from 447 to 751 AD, to the thrones of Europe and Jerusalem.
The Roman Catholic Church tried to kill off all remnants of this dynasty and their guardians, the Cathars and the Templars, during the Inquisition, in order to maintain power through the apostolic succession of Peter instead of the hereditary succession of Mary Magdalene.
A variation on the theory is that instead of dying on the cross, Jesus fled to Kashmir where he died in old age, returning to Srinagar where he had originally been influenced by Buddhist teachings.
This theory is lent credence by close comparisons of Jesus' sayings in the Gnostic Gospel of St Thomas, which are seen by some as closely paralleling classical Buddhist Sutras.
The theory also has parallels with other "disciple flight to distant lands" stories, such as the journey of Joseph of Arimathea to England after the death of Jesus taking with him a piece of thorn from the Crown of Thorns, which he later planted in Glastonbury. I'm glad that you are finally starting to waken to the false dogma you have preached over the last 3+ years. I'm sure that Knots and uncrazy would be happy to help show you the next steps you need to truly see the truth.
Again, I am glad to see that you have finally come to your senses about christianity's false teachings. Now you must try and undo the damage that your old teachings have done to people such as SOC and Seal.
I'm sure that there are many people that will support you on your new path to enlightenment.
Peace
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| Aug 21 @ 11:57 AM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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Loreli
Posts: 20,161
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lots of different descriptions of Him. We have lots of descriptions?
I'm confused now....
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| Aug 21 @ 12:17 PM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,495
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More from the great site Bev reccommended: The Tragedy of Christ
In turning our attention to Holy Week and the story of the Crucifixion, it is obvious that there is need to recount the details of it, and yet, it is so well known and so familiar that the words in which it is couched are apt to mean little and often go unrealized.
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The tale of Christ's triumphant entry into Jerusalem, the cleansing of the temple and the releasing of the animals, of His gathering the disciples together into the upper room, and there sharing with them the communion of bread and of wine, and of the desertion of those who supposedly loved Him, with His subsequent agony in the Garden of Gethsemane, is as familiar to us as our own names, and much less arresting.
And that is the tragedy of Christ....
He did so much, and we have recognized so little. It has taken us twenty centuries to even begin to understand Him and His mission and career. The Crucifixion itself was only an anticipated and expected consummation. No other end was possible. It was predetermined from the beginning, and dated from the time when, after the Baptism initiation, He started out to serve humanity, and to teach and preach the good tidings of the kingdom of God.
That was His theme, and we have forgotten it and have only preached the Personality of Christ - the one theme which He Himself ignored and which seemed to Him of small importance in view of the greater values involved. This again is the tragedy of Christ. He had one set of values and the world has another.
We have made of the Crucifixion a tragedy, whereas the real tragedy was our failure to recognize its true significance. The agony in the Garden of Gethsemane was based upon the fact that He was not understood. Many have died violent deaths. In this, Christ was in no wise different from thousands of other farseeing men and reformers, even down thru the ages.
Many people have passed through the Gethsemane experience and prayed with the same fervor as Christ that God's will might be done. Many have been deserted by those who might have been expected to understand and participate in the work and service visioned. In none of these respects was Christ unique.
But His suffering was based upon a unique vision. The lack of comprehension of the people, and the distorted interpretations which future theologians would give to His message must surely have been a part of the prevision, as likewise the knowledge that the emphasis accorded to Him as the Savior of the world would retard for centuries the materializing of the kingdom of God on earth, which was His mission to found.
Christ came that all mankind might have "life... more abundantly." Yet we have so interpreted His words that only the "saved" are credited with having taken the necessary steps towards that life. But the abundant life is surely not a life to be lived hereafter, in some distant heaven where those who are believers shall enjoy an exclusive life of happiness, whilst the rest of God's children are left for naught.
The Cross was intended to indicate the line of demarcation between the kingdom of men and the kingdom of God, between one great kingdom in nature which had reached maturity, and another kingdom in nature which could now enter upon its cycle of activity. The human kingdom had evolved to the point where it had produced the Christ and those other children of God whose lives bore constant testimony to divine nature.
Christ assumed the ancient symbol and burden of the cross, and, taking His stand beside all the previous crucified Saviors, embodied in Himself the immediate and the cosmic, the past and the future, rearing the Cross on the hill outside Jerusalem (the name of which signifies the "vision of peace"), thus calling attention to the kingdom which He died to establish.
The work had been completed, and in that far away little country called the Holy Land, a narrow strip of territory between the two hemispheres, the East and the West, the Orient and the Occident, Christ mounted the Cross and fixed the boundary between the kingdom of God and the kingdoms of the world, between the world of men and the world of Spirit. Thus He brought to a climax the ancient Mysteries, which had prophesied the coming of that kingdom, and instituted the Mysteries of the kingdom of God.
The effort to carry out to perfection the will of God brought to an end the most complete life that had been lived on earth. The attempt to found the kingdom, preordained for all time, and the antagonism it evoked, brought Christ to the place of crucifixion.
The hardness of men's hearts, the weakness of their love, and their failure to see the vision, broke the heart of the Savior of the world - a Savior because He opened the door into the kingdom and none would walk through.
It is time that the Church understood its true mission, which is to materialize the kingdom of God on earth, today, here and now. The time is past wherein we can emphasize a future and coming kingdom.
Continued
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| Aug 21 @ 12:17 PM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,495
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People are no longer interested in a possible heavenly state or a probable hell. They need to learn that the kingdom is here, within us all, and must express itself on earth; it consists of those who do the will of God at any cost, as Christ did, and who can love one another as Christ loved us.
The way into that kingdom is the way that Christ trod. It involves the sacrifice of the personal self for the good of the world, and the service of humanity instead of the service of one's own selfish opinions and desires. In the course of enunciating these new truths concerning love and service, Christ lost his life.
Is it not understood that the Crucifixion of Christ, with its great preceding events - the communion and the Gethsemane experience -is a tragedy which has its basis in the conflict between love and hate?
It is not to belittle the events which took place upon Calvary. But today, as one looks back upon that event, a certain truth begins to emerge, and we have mistakenly interpreted that sacrifice and that death in purely selfish terms.
We are concerned only with our own individual interests. We have emphasized only the importance of our individual salvation and pride it to be of tremendous importance.
But the world view and what Christ was destined to do for all humanity down through the ages, and the attitude of God towards human beings from the earliest times, through the period of Christ's life in Palestine and on until the present time, are subordinated to the factor of our belief or non-belief in the efficacy of the Crucifixion upon Calvary to save our individual souls.
Yet in His conversation with the repentant thief, Christ admitted him into the kingdom of God on the basis of his own recognition and understanding of divinity. Christ had not yet died nor was He resurrected, and the blood sacrifice of Christ had not yet been made.
It was as if Christ had foreseen the turn which theology would give to His death, and endeavored to offset it by making the recognition of the dying thief one of the most outstanding events at His death, for He made no reference to the remission of sins through His blood as the reason for that admission.
Peace
[Edited on 8/21/2008 12:24 PM]
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| Aug 21 @ 1:14 PM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,495
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Bev,
Why are you ignoring your own thread?
The site you reccommended is great.
Lots of good topics can be found there.
Peace
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| Aug 21 @ 3:43 PM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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uncrazy
Posts: 1,489
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Sail,
Thank you for the references.
He was Jewish, black beard. prominent nose. What we see is art, and the church had very strict guidelines for colors of hair, clothing, and position. If you didn't paint it their way you got no commission. And his appearance has little value to the story...part of a fable's detail. Making him blonde hides European racism and anti-Jewish sentiments...these are ancient and condoned by the church until only recently when the pope declared the Jews not responsible for the death of Jesus. And they know much, much more.
Many of the oldest paintings were not named by for a class like penitent, blessed,
in prayer, ascending. many names we know them by were added later by owners.
We have Jesus's base of ops in Capharnum, but he was centered somewhere else later. It is dangerous to find this place...the tomb would be their they moved the three crossmen to for the burial alive. Breaking the thieves legs most likely at the ankle would have been painful, but it wouldn't have killed them. The cruel crucifixion was designed to show the results of rebelling against Rome for the maximum amount of time.
In thinking of this tomb, I suspect it hasn't had a 1000 visitors since 30AD. The church story protects the site from rambling tourists to the Holy Land.
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| Aug 21 @ 4:44 PM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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Lore, you have to pick and choose. I think the emerald, from what I can find might be the most credible.
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| Aug 21 @ 4:47 PM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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Wow, sail, where did you find that stuff. I only found the descriptions. I should be more careful and read stuff on the sides, if that was where you found that.
Jesus didn't have a child, lol. and the rest is lukewarm stuff, sorry, guys, didn't know that was there, that stuff sail posted is garbage, and if I had known it was there I would have never used that site. There are others with the descriptions and letters that don't have that stuff on there.
Wow, sail, you should LOVE that site, lol.
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| Aug 21 @ 6:00 PM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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sail_dancer
Posts: 8,495
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So we have another instance of Bev reccommending a site that she later says she doesn't agree with.
How many times has this happened people? Just goes to show how much creedence you can place on Bev's posts. Remember she is supposedly a minister and christian counseler with a masters degree.
How can any of you take anything she says seriously! 
Peace
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| Aug 21 @ 8:37 PM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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uncrazy
Posts: 1,489
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Bev,
Interesting note from you on the child of Jesus and Magdalene. The dogma has Jesus as celibate forever...because sex is not an easy topic for the church. The likely practice of celibacy for priests was not one of holiness as it was for the Jewish Essenes, the church was afraid a woman in the line of David would create a David...serious impact to the apostolic succession in the church. The church acted contrary to Paul's guidance on the clergy being married. Just part of the war between the church and the House of David.
Even with insight of the special babtism, you missed the two betrothal ceremonies betwen Jesus and Magdalene. the first was a promise, the second one happenned when pregnancy was confirmed.
The catholic church has just recently stated it had evidence that Jesus had a child...but you dislike the catholic church. This, even though your church as well as all the others drives from it.
The little gorls name was Tamar...you can find a similiar named daughter to an earlier king named David, the king of both Isreal and Judea.
It kind of makes sense since as a rabbi Jesus knew his peoples history, and as a David was repeating it with changes by clarifying our relationship to the Father.
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| Aug 21 @ 8:46 PM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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Bah, un, just plain old bah.
If he had been married and had a child the Bible would have said so. Why wouldn't it have?
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| Aug 21 @ 8:49 PM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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Jesus was God in the flesh, why would he have married a human woman? Gee, un, that is just way out of it.
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| Aug 21 @ 8:50 PM |
Evidence of Jesus?
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16knots
Posts: 3,627
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Bible seems to be deficient in many things about an alleged "Jesus". For example what about the huge amount of missing years????
 Maybe he was whoring, drinking and having a great time as a Roman soldier
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| Aug 21 @ 8:58 PM |
Evidence of Jesus? |
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bevrice
Posts: 11,145
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Lol, knotts, he never even began his ministry until, I think, he was thirty. There was no reason to write of his everyday existance, I am sure he was a little boy, there is something about him in the Temple at the age of twelve. Then, from all accounts, he was a carpenter with Joseph. They didn't include those things because they weren't important. If he had been doing anything important, it would be in the Bible.
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