| Apr 19 @ 5:07 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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bunnybiz
Posts: 4,759
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Does Daddy God (LOVE) sent is Son Jesus Christ - Savior of the World and Fail? That is what I have been told. Jesus Fails and only saves a few of us. What?? Is that really right?
And what is Hades (a Greek god of the underworld doing in my bible which came from the Egyptian gods - Osiris of the underworld where all kinds of torture is going on ) Hebrew word sheol and the Greek word hades are both translated into the two English words “hell” and “grave.” The Hebrew word sheol is translated “hell” 31 times and is also translated “grave” 31 times—the SAME Hebrew word.
Did you know
First the “hell” of four centuries ago:
Webster’s Twentieth Century Dictionary:
“hell, n. [ME, helle; AS, hell, hell, from helan, to
cover, conceal.]”
or
Tell a person back in the dark ages of
England to “go to hell” and he would probably go to a cool cellar and bring back
some potatoes for dinner. For that is where they stored potatoes—in hell.
Here are the words for which "hell" was inserted as a "translation" into English:
The Hebrew word sheol (31 times)
The Greek word gehenna (12 times)
The Greek word hades (10 times)
The Greek word tartarus (1 time)
The Hebrew word sheol and the Greek word hades are synonymous in meaning.
And here is the proof from the Scriptures and the inspiration of the Holy Spirit that the Hebrew sheol and the Greek hades are identical in meaning:
Acts 2:27: "Because You will not leave My soul in hell [Gk: hades], neither will You suffer your Holy One to see corruption" is quoted from:
Psalm 16:10: "For You will not leave My soul in hell [Heb: sheol]; neither will You suffer your Holy One to see corruption."
And so the inspiration of the Spirit of God proves that the Greek word hades is the right and proper translation of the Hebrew word sheol.
It is astonishing how much of Christian theology is pagan in origin. Job was inspired by God’s Spirit to write, “Shall MORTAL man be more just than God?” Job 4:17)
It is dead people who are raised in the resurrection, not cadavers which once belonged to living people (I Cor. 15:51-54). Did the Old Testament patriarchs believe in the “immortality of the soul?” No. Did Paul believe in the “immortality of the soul?” No. Didn't God tell us We shall surely die. The dead have no thoughts, voices, nothing.. Death is sleep.
And how if God calls (which means dragged) or chose us not we not Him can we be saved? It is by His faith, His Grace, His Will not ours. Is our will greater than God's Will? If it is, than how can God be God? So what am I trying to say. The Holy Scriptures are True. However, the Bible and translation of it have errors.
GOD is True (Truth)
I Titus 1:2 - In hope of eternal life, which God, that does not lie, promised before the world began.
Numbers 23: 19 - God is not a man, that He should lie, Nor a son of man, that He should repent; Has He said, and will He not do it? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?
God's WORD is True (Truth)
John 7:17 - If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.
John 10:35 - If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
II Timothy 3:16 - All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for
doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness
Then the following Scriptures also have to be True
1. I John 4:14 - We have seen and testify that the Father has sent the Son to be the SAVIOR OF THE WORLD.
2. I Timothy 2: 4 - Who (God) will have ALL men to be saved, and to come to the knowledge of the truth
3. Phil 2:13 - for it is God who works in you, both TO WILL and TO DO for His good pleasure.
4. II Peter 3:9 - The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is long-suffering to us-ward, not Willing that any should perish, but that ALL should come to repentance.
5. Isaiah 46:10 I am God, and there is no one like me, declaring the end from the beginning and from ancient times things not yet done, saying, 'my counsel WILL stand, and I WILL accomplish all my purposes.”
6. I John 4:7-8 - Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is LOVE.
7. 1 Corinthians 13:8 - LOVE never fails.
Daddy GOD so LOVED the WORLD (All, Everyone, man, women, boy, girl, from beginning time to the end) that He Sent His Only Son JESUS CHRIST as SAVIOR OF THE WORLD. (Not just Christians.) That is why Jesus Died on the Cross for ALL our sins and He is the Risen Lord. Does God fail in saving the World? God does not lie. His Word is True then God (LOVE) Does Not Fail. His Will Be Done in Saving ALL.
What a glorious reunion day that will be!!
Has He said, and will He not do it? Or has He spoken, and will
He not make it good?
Daddy God is truly LOVE!!
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| Apr 19 @ 6:56 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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jamminjerry
Posts: 4,085
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ya onna roll hon! ya forgot to mention Hel, Loki's daughter! anyway, just maybe you will get a little discussion outta the "nonchristians" but the pseudos, i doubt it. LOL we be jammin 
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| Apr 19 @ 7:34 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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sail_dancer
Posts: 9,866
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Bunny,
Good post.
It is nice to see a christian wake up to what the bible really says.
You missed one of the passages that I believe tells it "all":1 John 2
1--My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have one who speaks to the Father in our defense--Jesus Christ, the Righteous One.
2--He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
Welcome to the joys of the "good news" Jesus actually taught.
By the way, I agree with Jerry. You will not get much participation from the christians in this forum. They live in denial of the scripture you cited.
Peace
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| Apr 19 @ 7:38 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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Peabianjay
Posts: 1,790
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Cool post, Bunnybiz. Great info!
Rather amusing how changes resulting from (mis)translations, or changes to our language (ie "hell") influence modern day interpretation.
As much as people are amazed at so-called "flaws" and "contradictions", I find it much more amazing that The Bible has (more or less) remained intact for so long.
P.S. Be nice to us nonchristians! *hugs* Some of us try to be nice!
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| Apr 19 @ 7:43 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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bunnybiz
Posts: 4,759
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I went to church (which I possibly be leaving, praying about it) this morning and ask the person driving me, is Jesus Christ Savior of the World (whole)? And he looked at me like what  He said that Jesus Christ only saves a few and the rest burn  . And I said then how can he be Savior of the Whole World? He was clueless  He couldn't see it. God hasn't opened his eyes up yet. I mentioned the discrepancies in the word hell. He still didn't see it. Sad.
Sail_dancer, You are probably right. Now that my eyes are open, I have to share the Good News. I couldn't put everything I wanted to as this limits your words. I was hoping that I would hear from those like-minded. God bless you.
You know that I love the Non-Christians as I do the Christians. The Non-Christian has know some of these truths for quite awhile. 
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| Apr 19 @ 8:36 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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Peabianjay
Posts: 1,790
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You know that I love the Non-Christians as I do the Christians
Good to hear! That, to me, is what christianity should be.
My only concern/criticism regarding christianity, is those that profess to be Christian, yet exhibit few if any, positive evidence. Those that kill "in the name of god", or use religion to further political agendas, for example. Seems to be rather un-christian to me (but *gasp* as a non-christian, I don't have the "right" to be critical).
(The same applies to many 'peaceful' religions, not just Christianity.)
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| Apr 20 @ 12:00 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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bunnybiz
Posts: 4,759
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My only concern/criticism regarding christianity, is those that profess to be Christian, yet exhibit few if any, positive evidence. Those that kill "in the name of god", or use religion to further political agendas, for example. Seems to be rather un-christian to me (but *gasp* as a non-christian, I don't have the "right" to be critical).
I definitely agree with you. I just been shaken to the core of my being finding out what damnable man-made doctrines, heresies .. in what I thought was Christian .. or it should be refer to Christendom. I was disgusted and cried and now overjoyed to learn the Truth!! I am not perfect (but being perfected) but I believe that there should be fruit evident in my life as a follower of Christ which is Love.. love for my enemies and brothers and sisters. So please forgive me.
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| Apr 20 @ 12:54 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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Peabianjay
Posts: 1,790
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So please forgive me. No need! (Not from us peons, anyway!)
Forgive you for what? Being human? Having empathy? *gasp* I say, "Kudos!"
The best a person can be is a person trying to be their best.
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| Apr 20 @ 1:08 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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CPUfan
Posts: 7,983
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As you all say, 'hell' is a place created by human beings for other human beings of their choice and preference.
Why would a creator wish to see so many suffer for bearing the free will we all possess?
Nice to see so many here who are convinced that hell is not inevitable. 
What a breath of fresh air!  
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| Apr 20 @ 1:57 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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Peabianjay
Posts: 1,790
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Curiously...
In my non-christian beliefs....I've always viewed the "promise" of "hell on earth" vs "heaven on earth" simply a matter of the world we create for ourselves. The best way to reach the latter is following the tenants of religious faith. (Not necessarily Christian.)
That is, the same earth, the same reality....could either be perceived as "heaven" (if you are at peace) or "hell" (if you are not).
The idea of fluffy clouds & angels & harps (or whatever) seemed bizarre to me. The challenges of day-to-day life are necessary for our happiness. The stereotypical heaven would be miserably boring!
Similarly for "hell". Fire & brimstone? Sure, it'd suck for a while, but you'd get used to it (eventually): thus, not eternal. The hell many create for themselves is eternal....well...until they find peace (via finding God, marriage councellor, yoga, or whatever)
So, "heaven" and "hell" can exist side by side. Joe & Bob. One's in heaven, one's in hell, yet they're both stuck in the same traffic jam.
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| Apr 20 @ 9:06 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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southernlass
Posts: 2,240
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I think that false teachings and false teachers tend to confuse more than anything else. They also tend to stand alone, or stand out in the crowd. When literally hundreds of thousands of mainstream, reputable biblical scholars who have researched the Bible believe one thing and one man rises to claim that all of these are wrong, it bears paying attention to the red flag of caution, in my opinion.
Personally, I've experienced times when I was confused and was seeking truth. There were many versions of such "truth" available to me out in the world. Sifting through them all and finding the right one, getting on the right path, and remaining on that path wasn't easy. Be sure and do your research on this guy and don't buy into his doctrine because it sounds good or goes contrary to what you think you want to hear. While it might appeal to you and "tickle your ears," if it doesn't save your soul and bring you face to face with the Lord Jesus Christ and His plan for your life, then you may have been sold a bill of goods that isn't worth the cyberspace its printed on.
"For the time will come when they shall not endure sound teaching, but after their own lusts they shall heap to themselves teachers who tell them what they want to hear,, and they will turn away their ears from the truth..." 2 Tim .4:3
It speaks for itself that L. Ray closes with this:
Isn’t is just amazing what we can learn when we just read and truth of God’s Word instead of the strange and unscriptural teaching of theologians?
L. Ray has never learned the lesson we note here:
http://www.tektonics.org/qt/solex.html
L. Ray has not merely relied on God's Word himself: He has appealed to meanings in Greek, and God's Word did not teach him Greek. But L. Ray no doubt will continue to take consolation in his own inconsistencies even as he fails to see them.
http://www.tektonics.org/qt/smithlr02.html
Last night I was perusing L. Ray Smith’s Bible-Truths web site as I tend to do from time to time and I came across a paper entitled Which Bible Translation is Best?. For all of you who are not familiar with L. Ray Smith, he is a universalist (as well as an anti-Trinitarian) whom I have corresponded with here.
http://rdtwot.wordpress.com/2007/07/12/l-ray-smith-and-matthew-2819/
(lots of text at the above link, too much to site, but feel free to read through it....yada yada yada)
So the scholarly concensus is that Matthew 28:19 as it appears in ALL MSS that contain Matthew 28:19 is original. It seems that Mr. Smith has made a ‘mountain’ out of a mole-hill.
You may do your own study of the book Mr. Smith has been quoting if you wish but for this paper we will get back to the subject at hand:
Back to the above scripture, L. Ray is quoting from this Emphatic Diaglott, which seems to be full of errors, and translated by a man with apparently no translating skills. Those who study from this book are mainly the Jehovah’s Witnesses and seem to have very similar beliefs to that of Mr. L. Ray. It seems that he has shaped his entire belief system around this book and its students.
http://www.pastorharris.org/id31.html
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| Apr 20 @ 10:49 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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uncrazy
Posts: 2,382
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SL,
When literally hundreds of thousands of mainstream, reputable biblical scholars who have researched the Bible believe one thing and one man rises to claim that all of these are wrong, it bears paying attention to the red flag of caution, in my opinion.
For over 2 centuries now, bible scholars have been using a scientic method called "textual criticism" to reconstruct what the NT most likely said.
Your hundreds of thousand of scholars sounds a bit high...but it does give authority to your opinion.
I would offer works of the scholar Bart Erhman for reading...he is one of many in the field who have studied the ancient texts in Greek, Hebrew, French and German, for over thirty years. I would venture that the sights you offer for review above will say similiar things about Mr. Erhman as they offer for L. Ray.
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| Apr 21 @ 6:18 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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CPUfan
Posts: 7,983
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mainstream, reputable biblical scholars who have researched the Bible In 1776 they were all English... but Americans had a different view of the creation... 
How does one reason out the correct interpretation of the Bible using only faith? Or do we just take the 'establishment' word for it... now that would truly require great faith...
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| Apr 21 @ 8:32 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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southernlass
Posts: 2,240
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Every individual has to make up his or her own mind about what the right course is for their life. There are countless doors to choose from. It's kind of like that game show, "The Bachelor" with twenty five different ladies or gents to choose from. One is more right than the others one decides to select.
Because of the sheer total of choices, a person needs to back something that is a winner, that works in the person's life, that can be relied upon. I believe God's Word, that there are countless imitations, false doctrines, and false teachers. We have freedom of choice as human beings on this planet; God has given us this. Because of our free will and freedom to choose, we bear the responsibility for our choices of faith, no faith, or something in the middle and off the beaten path. My only point on this thread and the other about Mr. L. Ray Smith's doctrine, is that in these times, I think it's wise to utilize caution.
When one is dying of thirst and a mirage of water appears in the desert, it doesn't mean that the mirage is going to quench one's thirst.
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| Apr 21 @ 9:24 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,284
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Bunny
If you have not read this before please do so it will help you look at things from a reality of truth way. The Age Of Reason
Since you are doing critical research as to what is and what is not try reading this it is a critique of things just as you are doing. Why I am not a Christian by Bertrand Russell
Last but not least here is an a link that gives you a source of Christianity from 1690 BC forward. The Real Source Of Christianity
SL you know nothing more than anyone on here from any direct experience.. 
[Edited on 4/21/2009 9:39 AM]
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| Apr 21 @ 9:51 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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southernlass
Posts: 2,240
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Yash, dear, I don't claim to be able to prove anything any more than you or anyone else can. No one can prove their belief is the only way and that's just the truth; hence each person must make up their own mind for themselves. There will always be those who attempt to influence others in one direction or another and I see nothing wrong with this when it's handled courteously. As there are indeed countless choices available, I think caution and careful research are wise when looking through the smorgasbord of beliefs and doctrines that are available.
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| Apr 21 @ 10:01 AM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,284
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Believe it or not SL I agree with you. I see no harm in anyone reading any dogma or opinion on Christianity or Buddhism or or or although I hope they keep an open mind instead of accepting anything just on face value.
Which bible or Christian sect is the correct one, some will say none of them but that is to be left to each person. Because it is written [which version] is not to be accepted that one dogma sect is better than another. It all depends on the person and what rings true to them at some time in this life although each has a right to change from one religion to another or sect within Christianity itself. It is all part of the living and growing process.
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| Apr 21 @ 1:01 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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CPUfan
Posts: 7,983
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While it might appeal to you and "tickle your ears," if it doesn't save your soul and bring you face to face with the Lord Jesus Christ and His plan for your life, then you may have been sold a bill of goods that isn't worth the cyberspace its printed on. Sounds to me like we're in danger of losing our souls if we do not choose as others do... I wonder if we now lose our soul if we don't discover Jesus' plan for our lives?
Or are we now simply issuing genuine soul certificates for salvation?
Is knowledge of resurrection to eternal life through Jesus no longer sufficient in itself?
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| Apr 21 @ 6:05 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate?
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Thor1960303
Posts: 3,345
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Why does "God" necessarily have to be either one? Because "good" and "evil" are constructs on man, based on behavior and morality. Morality exists so that society can function. Would a supreme being who is omniscient necessarily need a concept of good and evil? What good would such do for him, her, it or they?
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| Apr 21 @ 8:24 PM |
A God of Love or A God of Hate? |
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Gallows_Humor
Posts: 13,679
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you will find what you are looking for here...
(cliff notes to the new testament...)
http://www.truthnet.org/Christianity/Hebrews/Introduction/
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