| Aug 3 @ 7:47 PM |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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How many of you believe "what goes around - comes around?
I have found that even a lot of my Christian friends believe this.
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| Aug 3 @ 8:06 PM |
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uab_5
Posts: 4,759
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I call it "pay it forward", "you reap what you sow"...
Or as a JROTC instructor taught me back in 9th grade...
"You make your bed, you sleep in it!"
One can't expect good works done in his/her favor if he/she has never been willing to do good works first.
God bless.
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| Aug 3 @ 8:32 PM |
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iam01
Posts: 6,283
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Time to call the Karma Police...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5LeLAELIxKY
Karma police, arrest this man, he talks in maths
He buzzes like a fridge, hes like a detuned radio
Karma police, arrest this girl, her hitler hairdo, is making me feel ill
And we have crashed her party
This is what you get, this is what you get
This is what you get, when you mess with us
Karma police, Ive given all I can, its not enough
Ive given all I can, but were still on the payroll
This is what you get, this is what you get
This is what you get, when you mess with us
And for a minute there, I lost myself, I lost myself
And for a minute there, I lost myself, I lost myself
For a minute there, I lost myself, I lost myself 
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| Aug 4 @ 8:04 AM |
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Banned_Knots
Posts: 1,125
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Really doesnt matter if anyone believes or doesnt believe in Karma.
Karma translated means exactly "Action."
Looking at the whole universe we see nothing occurs without a cause for it to occur whether macro or micro universe. Actions only take place b ecause of a cause for it to occur.
Each action has its consequence which in itself is a further action or actions for further consequences.
Every action (karma) taken there follows its consequence from body or mind.
Do good deeds and good consequences of those good deeds follow. Likewise do bad deeds and the consequences of those bad deeds will have bad consequences.
Throw a stone into the pond and disturb the tranquil, serene nature of the pond you will see no perfect reflection of the sky.
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| Aug 4 @ 11:02 AM |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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Do good deeds and good consequences of those good deeds follow. Likewise do bad deeds and the consequences of those bad deeds will have bad consequences.
I agree. Do you think it sometimes carries over to another lifetime?
I had a hard time on my spiritual journey with the concept of heaven and hell.
I couldn't come up with anything that made sense, until I did a lot of thinking about karma. You can see people that seem to do so much good, but then suffer more than the people who do bad. If you didn't consider all lifetimes, none of it would make much sense to me.
Sometimes I can see karma come back almost instantly. Other times I don't always get what is going on. I think until we learn our lesson, we will keep on repeating the same mistakes and paying the same price!
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| Aug 4 @ 11:15 AM |
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Nightowl001
Posts: 7,509
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I used to have a throwaway line in my old MSN profile, Bj, that said: "I have to believe in Karma. I haven't done anything bad enough in this life to deserve this!"
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| Aug 4 @ 11:18 AM |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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Good point! 
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| Aug 4 @ 12:25 PM |
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iam01
Posts: 6,283
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The supernatural mumbo jumbo makes no real sense. Good things happen to bad people and bad things happen to good people. It just happens because people can be random targets, being in the wrong place at the the wrong time. A low life can win the lottery with the same chances of a nice person. Why should any of that be different? What does make sense is how people treat you based on how you treat them. Your close friends will be evidence of that. Have sex with one of their spouses and you will lose a friend. Well, maybe not. You might be doing them a favor. It all depends on the circumstances. Circumstance can dictate outcome but if you're smart, you'll dictate the circumstances too.
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| Aug 4 @ 12:46 PM |
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Banned_Knots
Posts: 1,125
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I agree. Do you think it sometimes carries over to another lifetime?
Yes, it does. The consequences of a good or bad actions do not necessarily follow through immediately. In a similar way when a tree drops an acorn it doesnt immediately start to grow. Further conditions must be met for that seed to germinate. e.g. temperature, moisture, nourishment, etc. The consequences of our own actions ripen when conditions are met and this can follow through into life times. Why were you born a female and not a male? Why were you born American and not Japanese? Why were you born at all? Why so many things occur in this particular life time?
Yes, certainly karma has a far greater consequence than we are aware of.
I had a hard time on my spiritual journey with the concept of heaven and hell.
Simply we are certainly the makers of our heaven and hells. In respect of what we create in this life time or the next.
I couldn't come up with anything that made sense, until I did a lot of thinking about karma. You can see people that seem to do so much good, but then suffer more than the people who do bad. If you didn't consider all lifetimes, none of it would make much sense to me.
When some people suffer that doesnt make sense then look at this way: if everything is love and roses then we would soon settle into spiritual drowsiness. Most become spiritually lazy and cease to develop. Times of suffering are our greatest spiritual teachers. They give us a wake up call to help us reassess our spiritual path if we look at it with wisdom.
People who do good are on a good spiritual path regardless of religion if the intentions are good. Often these people suffer the most in some way or another. In Buddhist terms the suffering helps to work off past bad karma. It helps us to see how suffering treats us and how we act with our actions can leads us further along the spiritual path. Dont get angry, dont get envious of others, dont get hateful because of what happened, etc but look within and develop outward love for the experience, towards others, towards our aggressors, even to ourselves. Does it make sense?
Sometimes I can see karma come back almost instantly. Other times I don't always get what is going on. I think until we learn our lesson, we will keep on repeating the same mistakes and paying the same price!
The mind can have terrible habitual behaviours. Facing our inner demons (our own minds) seeking what are the causes of these bahaviours is a way to stop them. Our mind becomes stagnant and fixed to repeat the same behaviours instead of looking in and letting go of all those actions causing the consequences of our habitual behaviours. Again our karmic actions giving rise to the consequences that make us repeat the same old thing whether in love, money, relationships or life times in general.
The Buddhists emphasis mind training. "Do good" Calm the mind" Do actions for the benefit of others." etc.
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| Aug 4 @ 5:03 PM |
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BandTMom
Posts: 38,061
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Dont get angry, dont get envious of others, dont get hateful because of what happened, etc but look within and develop outward love for the experience, towards others, towards our aggressors, even to ourselves. Does it make sense?
Yes. It makes a lot of sense. Our world is in the mess that it is because of people returning "evil" with evil. If we all returned everything with good, what a change we would see. 
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| Aug 5 @ 10:29 AM |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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If we all returned everything with good, what a change we would see.
I agree in a way BUT this is a very difficult thing to do. Also, this is an area I have real problems in. If someone treats you really bad and you turn around and treat them good, isn't that rewarding bad behavior and teaching people to treat you bad? I would really be interested in other peoples views on this, as I do concern myself with my actions and what they might bring back to me.
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| Aug 5 @ 11:30 AM |
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southernlass
Posts: 2,240
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I definitely believe in this concept but in Christianity it's called "You reap what you sow." It's true without a doubt. And I know what you mean about not understanding sometimes why we're getting some bad reaping back, but in Christianity, we also believe that God teaches us through circumstances and helps us to grow.
For example, often when one goes through something like a stroke, that leaves them disabled, they are angry and asking "why me?" We believe that God uses the disability in order to help us understand and really "get" what it's like to have to suffer in that way -- once we understand how this feels, there are countless people we can be an example for and help.
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| Aug 5 @ 11:39 AM |
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iam01
Posts: 6,283
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For example, often when one goes through something like a stroke, that leaves them disabled, they are angry and asking "why me?" We believe that God uses the disability in order to help us understand and really "get" what it's like to have to suffer in that way -- once we understand how this feels, there are countless people we can be an example for and help.
So in your head, diseases and infirmities are dispensed by God. Mental illness, delusion, stupidity and brain damage must really be a huge honor.  
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| Aug 5 @ 12:05 PM |
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iam01
Posts: 6,283
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Kind of sad. It really reveals what goes on in the mind of a brainwashed Christian. They see someone suffering and then become happy because its all God's will. The convoluted logic in their irrational minds is a danger to society. This is not isolated or unusual. This was Mother Teresa's legacy. She believed suffering was a gift from God and therefore did very little to ease the suffering of the dying. Despite the large sums of money she received, the conditions the dying lived in was appalling. They slept on cheat cots and the toilet facilities were horrible. Children were tied to beds and quack medicine was administered. Much more can be written in more detail about this.
[Edited on 8/5/2009 12:11 PM]
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| Aug 5 @ 12:57 PM |
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Banned_Knots
Posts: 1,125
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...but in Christianity, we also believe that God teaches us through circumstances and helps us to grow.
This would infer that God is the cause of consequence when it would not be true because nothing happens, nothing arise unless a cause is made from other consequences to produce the present actions. We are the architects of our lives and when things occur in our lives it is because we produced the actions that led to it.
For example, often when one goes through something like a stroke, that leaves them disabled, they are angry and asking "why me?"
This happens for sure but the causes of our condition is through what we do, our actions. It is only natural for the human body to break down and hence how we accept it is very much up to us.
We believe that God uses the disability in order to help us understand and really "get" what it's like to have to suffer in that way -- once we understand how this feels, there are countless people we can be an example for and help.
It would be wonderful to have al all creator being grant us wishes and allow us to understand the greater workings of life but sadly this has never been so.
Disabilities, again, occur because of consequences. There is never an instant devine intervention that suddenly sweeps away all past actions and consequences to make the present situation tolerable or less painful. We avoid lung cancer by helping ourselves avoid the causes of lung cancer. We cue a head ache by the actions of taking a pain reliever or better still dont take the actions that lead to a head ache. i.e. take a rest from MD or the Rock Concert.
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| Aug 5 @ 1:06 PM |
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kjac
Posts: 8,163
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I'm not sure if it's entirely the same thing, but I have noticed something in my own life.
The happier I am, the more things seem to go right for me. As if surrounding myself with positive thoughts made positive things happen.
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| Aug 5 @ 1:32 PM |
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Merchitown
Posts: 6,130
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For example, often when one goes through something like a stroke, that leaves them disabled, they are angry and asking "why me?" We believe that God uses the disability in order to help us understand and really "get" what it's like to have to suffer in that way -- once we understand how this feels, there are countless people we can be an example for and help.
Ok, this really rankles. My sister has been through soooo freakin' much from SERIOUS child abuse, to having Asberger's (a high-functioning form of autism) that wasn't diagnosed until much later in her life as it was masked, depression, and partially paralyzed after a car accident with her adoptive family that she hadn't lived with but for 6 months at the age of 9. She's lived in a nursing home, group home, had a fiancee that put her aside, etc. Her dream? To just have a family.
Now, I've heard it said that God doesn't give out more than one can handle, that He gave this to her in order to help her understand others' suffering. Oh yes, she's very empathetic, to animals, young children, those who have been ganged up on. Was this necessary in order to gain that empathy? NO!! One can have a heart without being thrown through the wringer. Is she broken? Yep. She is. Still. She will not ever lead a "normal" adult life. Has God given her more than she can handle? Obviously...because it's requiring others to assist in her to handle it.
So, again with the platitudes, just not thinking through what it is exactly what one is saying.
As far Karma...LOL I'm just waiting for it to swing back my way.
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| Aug 5 @ 2:11 PM |
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alivenwell351
Posts: 3,040
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^^^^^^^^Merch.....
Yep...just another one of those little "quirks" that I can't imagine any loving god would do. Especially to "one of his children". You'd think someone who created heaven & hell and all in between would come up with a fairer way of getting his/her/it's messages across.
I mean your sister, and who knows how many others who did nothing to deserve it, go through this kind of shit, and Manson, Ramirez, the unibomber etc, just live right on with no devine retribution?? I mean if this god wanted to show an example of his love and fairness and his ire at those who would do harm to any of his own...a sort of cosmic teaching moment...you'd think he'd slam the hell out of the evil ones (a spinning scythe would certainly get the message across!!) and spare the good folks anything more than they REALLY can handle.
I'm supposed to believe this christian god...this nasty, hateful, ego maniac of a prick...is a loving god?? A just god?? A fair god?? Let alone worship it and hope in the end I get to go live with it for eternity??
Give me a fkn break!!!
[Edited on 8/5/2009 2:17 PM]
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| Aug 5 @ 2:21 PM |
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Merchitown
Posts: 6,130
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And that's why I don't believe it's God's doing at all. That is her biological parents' doing, as well as just plain shitty bad luck. Wayyyy shitty. I don't think this was part of a "plan" at all.
LOL a spinning scythe!!
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| Aug 5 @ 2:33 PM |
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alivenwell351
Posts: 3,040
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yeah...the wrongs I could right with a spinning scythe!! Maybe Ron Popeil will come up with one. What an infomercial that would be!! 
I don't think this was part of a "plan" at all.
Seriously...do you believe there's actually a "plan"??
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