| Sep 23 @ 5:16 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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Thor1960303
Posts: 3,345
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Some Christians on this forum have expressed a fear of what they call "secular" or "atheistic" agendas, often mixing in conspiratoral views of history in with it.
HERE is an article about a program that was heavily supported by former presidential candidate Mike Huckabee. There is also a part of the article about a young man's experiences with such mental abuse.
I had to add more here. This article is a look into not only the mind of a troubled youth who lashed out against his Pentacostal upbringing with murder, but a look inside a few of these educational alternatives offered by the Christian Right. They've been selling the myth that strict adherence to conservative Christian dogma and instilling it in a child will result in the child growing up to be a well adjusted, functional, moral Christian adult.
Is this what they want for the whole country?
[Edited on 9/23/2009 5:47 PM]
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| Sep 23 @ 6:14 PM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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alivenwell351
Posts: 3,040
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I don't worry much about it...yet...
Huckabee bombed big time last year (a shame too, because except for the biblethumping, I liked a lot of his ideas...and he comes across as a nice guy), and back when Pat Robertson ran, he pulled something like 1/10th of 1% of the Republican primary vote. Hell, even the good reverend (and I use the term loosely!!) Jesse Jackson got nowhere, although I don't think religion had much if anything to do with that...
Though a majority of Americans do acknowledge themselves as christians, that same majority doesn't seem to have religious fanaticism anywhere near the top of their lists for what gets their votes. It seems that for the most part, real world real life christians have their sh*t together...
[Edited on 9/23/2009 6:28 PM]
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| Sep 23 @ 11:41 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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southernlass
Posts: 2,232
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That's an extremist perspective, Thor.
I seriously doubt that this is what moderate conservative Christians desire for the country. If they are at all political and value the constitution, then they'll realize that religious freedom is very important, and while I would love to embrace the separation of church and state, I'm only wary about doing so because it seems that while we're not allowed to push Christianity on the public, the secularists feel that they have been given free reign to push their anti-theist, anti-religious perspectives via the public venue in our universities and public schools; this is the epidemy of hypocrisy, imo, and thus we'll each continue to toss in our two cents via PACS and other special interests that impact legislation. And well we should, imo, because the secularists aren't going to stop doing so.
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| Sep 24 @ 12:14 AM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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SweetNapaGuy
Posts: 8,521
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Did anyone see the Values Voter Summit? The fundies are already attempting to pick who's going to be the Republican candidate...
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| Sep 24 @ 9:47 AM |
Christian Political Agendas
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,267
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Secular \Sec"u*lar\, a. [OE. secular, seculer. L. saecularis, fr. saeculum a race, generation, age, the times, the world; perhaps akin to E. soul: cf. F. s['e]culier.]
1. Coming or observed once in an age or a century. [1913 Webster]
The secular year was kept but once a century. --Addison. [1913 Webster]
2. Pertaining to an age, or the progress of ages, or to a long period of time; accomplished in a long progress of time; as, secular inequality; the secular refrigeration of the globe. [1913 Webster]
3. Of or pertaining to this present world, or to things not spiritual or holy; relating to temporal as distinguished from eternal interests; not immediately or primarily respecting the soul, but the body; worldly. [1913 Webster]
New foes arise, Threatening to bind our souls with secular chains. --Milton. [1913 Webster]
4. (Eccl.) Not regular; not bound by monastic vows or rules; not confined to a monastery, or subject to the rules of a religious community; as, a secular priest. [1913 Webster]
He tried to enforce a stricter discipline and greater regard for morals, both in the religious orders and the secular clergy. --Prescott. [1913 Webster]
5. Belonging to the laity; lay; not clerical. [1913 Webster]
I speak of folk in secular estate. --Chaucer. [1913 Webster]
The United States Is a Secular nation now as a functioning Government for the people and by the people as outlined in the Constitution.
Why do Christians fear the word Secular as Secular may be a religion to some is not everyone equal in our nation?
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| Sep 24 @ 11:53 AM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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I think by now all of you on this forum know that I respect all religions.
However, I will have to say that I think the radical religious right is becoming a very dangerous force in this country. I think the ones we have seen at the "town hall" meetings are from this group. They have the radical signs and some of them even have guns on their hip (which I think needs to be stopped).
Any religion can become radical. When it does it becomes a danger to society and to the children they are brainwashing.
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| Sep 24 @ 12:03 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,267
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I think the ones we have seen at the "town hall" meetings are from this group. People at these meetings did not come from a unified source neither Christian nor secular.
Those people were objecting to the endless spending by government and the take over of health care.
Health care has turned into a emotional agenda because of what our government is trying to do without congress even reading what they are voting on. In events like these you will get the weirdos from many sides they even bussed in Acorn and the Seiu union members, what about them?
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| Sep 24 @ 12:09 PM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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eastham
Posts: 7,913
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Did anyone see the Values Voter Summit? The fundies are already attempting to pick who's going to be the Republican candidate...
Or as John Stewart said the other night, who will come in 3rd in the Republican primaries...and that would be Mike Huckabee.
A quick perusal of the notable attendees of the summit and you'll see several aspiring presidential candidates...oh and one closeted senator. Tee hee.
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| Sep 24 @ 12:19 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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People at these meetings did not come from a unified source neither Christian nor secular
And you know this how?
I would say that most definitely many of those people ARE from the radical religious right. It is pretty obvious from their signs etc. I am sure that there are others, as you stated that are from other places, but many of them are obviously radicals. I believe some were planted by the insurance companies.
I do NOT believe all christians are radicals, but the ones that are can be dangerous, not only to themselves and their families, but to society.
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| Sep 24 @ 12:27 PM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,267
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People at these meetings were concerned about their pocket books not religion.
They were nutters there always are with their Hitler signs but one needs to look beyond the signs TV always shows people with signs but behind them are a lot more people without signs, ordinary everyday people.
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| Sep 24 @ 12:39 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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I didn't see too many "normal" looking ones, but maybe like you said, the media showed more of the radicals.
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| Sep 24 @ 12:43 PM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,267
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What I find interesting is the Christian right is against Obama health Government and the far left Christian are in favor of it. What gives?
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| Sep 24 @ 2:45 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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Thor1960303
Posts: 3,345
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the secularists feel that they have been given free reign to push their anti-theist, anti-religious perspectives via the public venue in our universities and public schools; this is the epidemy of hypocrisy,
I know that's a sore subject, but you've basically got one arena that I know of that isn't "religion friendly" so to speak in education and that's mainly in the sciences, which most moderates of any belief system don't have a problem with as they feel that science and religion are two different disciplines. While such teachings as creationism aren't welcome in the public schools and secular universities, the USA enjoys the first ammendment as well as being a free market econoomy which can allow anyone to hang a shingle out and start whatever school of whatever thought or belief they wish.
So I don't get your beef. 
Separation of church and state allows you to do your thing and me to do mine. 
What I find interesting is the Christian right is against Obama health Government and the far left Christian are in favor of it. What gives?
It's called cherry picking the Bible to make your political, moral, or philisophical point. Like most are Christians are anti communist as communism is historically an atheistic system, however, the communist regimes that took over the Latin American countries realized that Roman Catholicism wasn't going away, so they just incorporated it into Marxism making Jesus and his disciples socialist revolutionaries.
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| Sep 24 @ 5:31 PM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,964
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What I find interesting is the Christian right is against Obama health Government and the far left Christian are in favor of it. What gives?
I believe you can thank Fox News, Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck and others like them. They have convinced the radical religious right that it is not in their best interest to have insurance.
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| Sep 24 @ 9:02 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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southernlass
Posts: 2,232
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As a moderate conservative Christian, I'm an Independent, but many often consider me to be a part of the Christian right. I'm in favor of a lot of conservative principles and didn't vote for President Obama. I am, however, in favor of universal health care, which is chapping the hides of some who are on the right who are used to my backing them up on this and the political forum and in other forums that I stop by when I can. Unfortunately, I can't back them up in this case because I firmly believe that as Christian people, we must care about the poor who can't afford health insurance. I also believe that we must take care of the poor, the elderly, and the disabled who sincerely cannot care for themselves.
I firmly believe that healthcare is a right for all human beings and that it is inhumane and unreasonable not to see that we all have access to healthcare, each and every single one of us. I don't believe that anyone alive on this planet should have access to better healthcare than anyone else. We are all human beings and none are better than any other.
I see no way on earth that this could be refuted by any Christian, in particular. I am clear about what Jesus Christ said in the bible regarding the poor and the sick, and I don't doubt for a moment that He would find it not-Christian to ignore the poor and the sick and to let those who don't have the money go on without adequate healthcare.
At any rate, I believe very passionately in this matter of universal healthcare, and it's unfortunate that many of my Christian brethren on the right don't understand or agree with me.
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| Sep 24 @ 9:08 PM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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BandTMom
Posts: 38,061
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I do NOT believe all christians are radicals, but the ones that are can be dangerous, not only to themselves and their families, but to society.
ANY radical.....anything taken to the extreme, can be dangerous. It's those of all faiths and walks of life.
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| Sep 24 @ 9:27 PM |
Christian Political Agendas
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Jankia
Posts: 11,907
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What I find interesting is the Christian right is against Obama health Government and the far left Christian are in favor of it. What gives? What gives is the fact that you find interesting what has gone on in this country since 1776?
Christians are people that differ in what they believe politically.
Thats probaly breaking news to some people that label Christians according to what they find online about a Christian thats committed a wrong.
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| Sep 25 @ 9:10 AM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,267
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Jankia I was a Christian before you were born, been there done that.
Anytime you have Universal anything one size fits all it becomes rift with fraud. We have the best medical care in the world what is wrong with the medical care delivery system is not medicine. It simply is the cost of medicine...
Frankly Americans are the most over prescribed people on the planet. The proposed Bills that are being formed now are considering adding 50 million people to the roles of health care on a mandatory basis with the IRS being the enforcement agency. So if your out of work and do not have medical care the law as written would allow the IRS to seize everything as the government has declared mandatory insurance is a tax.
If you add 50 million people where do the additional doctors and nurses come from? This question is avoided by government.
There are those that say it is unconstitutional, I agree, in the end this will be settled by the supreme court if implemented, then what?
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| Sep 25 @ 9:27 AM |
Christian Political Agendas
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Deborah551
Posts: 1,019
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P.J. O'Rourke said "If you think health care is expensive now, wait until it's free."
If other people have to pay out of their pockets for your "right" to health care, then it's not a right and it's now a demand and the only way to enforce it is through taxes. Now, if you wan't to help people pay their medical bills from your own pocket, that's the Christian thing to do. But to force everyone to pay your medical bill is not what a responsible person does.
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| Sep 25 @ 9:44 AM |
Christian Political Agendas |
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Thor1960303
Posts: 3,345
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I firmly believe that healthcare is a right for all human beings and that it is inhumane and unreasonable not to see that we all have access to healthcare, each and every single one of us. I don't believe that anyone alive on this planet should have access to better healthcare than anyone else. We are all human beings and none are better than any other.
Agreed.  However, I also appreciate this point of view.
The proposed Bills that are being formed now are considering adding 50 million people to the roles of health care on a mandatory basis with the IRS being the enforcement agency. So if your out of work and do not have medical care the law as written would allow the IRS to seize everything as the government has declared mandatory insurance is a tax.
If you add 50 million people where do the additional doctors and nurses come from? This question is avoided by government.
There are those that say it is unconstitutional, I agree, in the end this will be settled by the supreme court if implemented, then what?
The problem is that we currently live under a system that profits from keeping sick people sick and broken things broken. That's why we're the most over prescribed people in the world. I think advertizing prescription drugs in the media is unethical because it sends a message to a very strong demographic that they need to be medicated. Pharmaceutical companies spend billions on advertizing and they have some of the slickest and most expensive ad campaigns out there. Ever notice too, that when you go to the doctor, you never stop getting billed? I mean you get bills from doctors you never saw and itemized statements to insurance companies are padded with drugs and procedures you never got as well as the prices being marked up 400%. Why is an aspirin 5 bucks when you get it in the hospital? I did a story once on an old man that went to the emergency room to get a fish hook removed from his thumb. I don't even think that he needed stitches. He was given an antibiotic and a tetanus booster and sent on his way. He was in and out in less than half an hour as it was done by physician's assistant in one of the cubicles, yet Medicare was billed almost a thousand dollars! . His itemized statement showed that he was taken to an operating room and everything from plastic stints to an IV drip were supposedly used.
Anytime you have Universal anything one size fits all it becomes rift with fraud.
Like privatizing something is a magic bullet against fraud? As long as people are people, there will be fraud regardless of what system is in place. Which system has more or less fraud potential? Ask me that question in a year when I've lived in Canada that long and used it. My wife swears by it and doesn't like the system here. She's a survivor of ovarian cancer and believes that she would've died had she been under my HMO. What I noticed in the short amount of time I spent in Ottawa was that more seems to be spent on preventative care than prescriptions and procedures. Sure, there are longer waiting lists, hospitals aren't as posh and Canadians who need an MRI or some other procedure may have to travel a little south to the US to get it done. However, I didn't see nearly as many morbidly obese people and I met quite a few old folks in their 80's who didn't look a day over 65.
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