| Oct 16 @ 8:57 AM |
The Gap Theory
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,236
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In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. -- Genesis 1:1
And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. -- Genesis 1:2
Some Christians believe there was a long gap (perhaps as long as 4.6 billion years) between the first two verses of Genesis. During this time there was a war in heaven, demons were cast down to earth, and nature was corrupted through demonic activity.
This interpretation addresses two problems caused by modern science: the age of the earth and the nature of nature. A straightforward reading of Genesis indicates that the earth is only about 6000 years old, not the 4.6 billion that science has found it to be. And disease, suffering, death, predators, and parasites are found throughout the living world, yet all were supposedly created by a kind and loving God. The gap theory allows Mother Nature to be both old and nasty, without casting blame on God or the Bible.
Needless to say, the gap theory is controversial among Bible-believers. Here are some links to believers on both sides.
Pro Gap
Gap Theory Interpretation of Genesis
To Gap or Not to Gap?
Anti Gap
AiG: From the beginning of the creation
ChristianAnswers.net: What is the "Gap Theory?"
The gap theory has big problems!
AllAboutCreation.org: Gap Theory - No Support
The Gap Theory
Apologetics Press: Popular Compromises of Creation—The Gap Theory
GotQuestions.org: What is the Gap Theory?
Carm.org: What is the gap theory?
ChristianCourier.com: Genesis 1:1-2 - The Gap Theory
Wikipedia
Gap Creationism Gap Theory What is your Theory?
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| Oct 17 @ 1:45 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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Angel54214
Posts: 18,174
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Needless to say...people make things more complicated than they actually are.
For at the 1st verse in Gen. 2 comes the acknowledgement of the creation completion that is versed in Gen. 1:
Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
In verse 2 and 3, God ended his creation works upon the 7th day and proceeds to bless and sanctify all the creations he completed, thus rests on this day from Creating:
And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made. And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
Verse 4 breaks down the generations and itemizes the events that took place at the time of each creation he had made:
These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,
Simple...no big words...no complexities. 
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| Oct 17 @ 2:07 AM |
The Gap Theory
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Josuha
Posts: 1,121
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Hebrew writers of the time first give a synops of a subject, then expand upon it.
You will also see writers making a statement by asking a question at the end.
There is no 'gap'.
It is simply the writer giving a brief overview then expounding.
Typical of writers of that era.
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| Oct 19 @ 10:24 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,236
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 Trying to use scripture to justify or explain the Gap is like throwing gasoline onto a fire, simply stupid.
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| Oct 19 @ 10:36 AM |
The Gap Theory
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ServantOfChrist2
Posts: 7,434
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I've never heard of "The Gap" before Yashaenka. 
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| Oct 19 @ 10:46 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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iam01
Posts: 6,270
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The Gap Theory should not be confused with God of the Gaps. That God of the Gaps has to do with gaps in knowledge and those who seek no knowledge, no logic have huge gaps in pretty much everything.
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| Oct 19 @ 10:50 AM |
The Gap Theory
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,236
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I've never heard of "The Gap" before Yashaenka Few Christians or others are really knowledgeable about The Gap Theory SOC you are not alone.
Check out the Pro and Con links on the Gap theory and you will be as knowledgeable as most about it.
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| Oct 19 @ 11:07 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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miner4aheartofgold
Posts: 13
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The dome on Mt. St. Helens and the island of Surtsey were both witnessed to be formed within the last 50 years. At what age does scientific dating put these if the eye witness account is not used?
http://emporium.turnpike.net/C/cs/time.htm
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| Oct 19 @ 11:21 AM |
The Gap Theory
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iam01
Posts: 6,270
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Miner
how does current volcanic activity have anything to do with historical activity? Cycles perhaps?
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| Oct 19 @ 11:22 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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uncrazy
Posts: 2,382
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This is a noticeable 400+ year gap between the events ascribed to David...suggesting that the story of David is a composite of two histories joined into one.
If the only source we allow ourselves is the OT and the teachings of clergy concerning David, it remains looking like a story about one man.
The story of David in the old testament is a good starting point to learn history of both Egypt and the Palestine area.
Few know that 3 giants were killed in the OT, both brothers to Goliath a creature of much older historical literature(1000 years) who was adopted as a Philistine by the Hebrew scribes and planted in the OT within David's story with only a name change for the victor. The other two giants were killed by Elhanan, which might be the original name for David...with the word David being more of a title.
Repeating stories are also seen on the tale told about Abraham, Sarah, and the pharoah. It's structure is repeated twice more.
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| Oct 19 @ 11:34 AM |
The Gap Theory
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uncrazy
Posts: 2,382
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Miner,
I have long been interested in the volcano Thera. It offers a geological component to both the Sodom and Gamorrah story and the plagues of Egypt.
Placing it is difficult, especially in that such an event would place writing history at the moment on the back burner behind survival. It will be recorded later to document the oral history of the remembrance of the event.
There are some gaps in the OT record where it might fit.
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| Oct 19 @ 9:20 PM |
The Gap Theory |
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Angel54214
Posts: 18,174
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Miner...here's a full set of large photos of the Surtsey Island volcanic process.
http://www.vulkaner.no/v/volcan/surtsey_e.html
Uncrazy...
This is a noticeable 400+ year gap between the events ascribed to David...suggesting that the story of David is a composite of two histories joined into one.
Bible Scholars use the books of Samuel and the first book of Kings to determine the approximity of David's life. The chronological dates put a 40 year gap as they have determined his life span 1037 to 970 BCE. An Israelite King could not rule until the age of 30, which was the age that he was annointed King. It's noted in Samuel that David ruled over Judah seven years and six months; In observation of the Jewish writings, the 6 months were subtracted due to his long illness in Hebron. David ruled in Jeruselem over Israel and Judah for 33 years, which makes his reign over Judah a total of 40 years minus the 6 month illness timeframe.
Before David was anointed King, he was a Shepard to his Father Jesse's flock. Saul took David as hire into his office and also made him his armor bearer for his army. This when David became instumental in music to sooth Saul's ears and calm his melancholy, for the Philistine army began gathering about to proclaim a war, which soon was faught in the Valley of Elah (valley of oak).
We are told in Kings that David die of old age, which from his Kingship ruling years, he died at age 70 leaving the Kingdom to his son Solomon and upon David's hour of death anointed him. The Jews made a proclamation that this day was Pentacost.
[Edited on 10/19/2009 10:38 PM]
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| Oct 20 @ 6:04 AM |
The Gap Theory
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,236
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Angel what is your source for this?
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| Oct 20 @ 7:07 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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sail_dancer
Posts: 9,865
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An Israelite King could not rule until the age of 30 This seems to support uncrazy's theory that Jesus reappears at age 30 to claim his right to the David kingship.
Could Jesus been in hiding until old enough to claim the throne of David?
Peace
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| Oct 20 @ 4:01 PM |
The Gap Theory
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uncrazy
Posts: 2,382
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Angel54 offered comments above to my earlier statement without addressing it....
This is a noticeable 400+ year gap between the events ascribed to David...suggesting that the story of David is a composite of two histories joined into one.
The note that "an Israelite King could not rule until the age of 30, which was the age that he was annointed King" lacks thought. I guess they would have had to remain kingless if the king died before his successor reached 30 years.
Some ideas easily show they have not been thought out. Kings in the days of David and before, seldom if ever abdicated wirhout losing their lives by the pretender. Some co-regencies in Egypt are seen to safequard the transfer of power at the kings death.
The only rule I can find relating to age is the marrying of dynasts to continue a patriarchal line. The minor lines married at 25, the major dynast married at 36. This allowed for a girl to be born, and after a 3 year waiting period, a son could still be sired before the man reached 40 years or his generation. The time waited between sons was six years.
To move research forward on the 400+ year gap between two Davids, we can use the life span 1037 to 970 BCE offered for the David that fought repeatedly against the Philistines, along with 3 giants from the time of Moses and older Egypt.
To see if a description the bible offers for David fits this David we can look at "a man ruling the lands from the Nile to the Euphrates". This is also the promise given to Abraham's line.
This kingdom had started coming apart at the end of Amenhotep lll's reign and the kingdom did not exist during the reign of your David.
The kingdom was not re-united again after your David by Cyrus the Great who let the Jews leave Babylon in an exodus ro Palestine.
We might be able to eventually find dates for both Davids and get a clearer look at what the OT offers us.
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| Oct 23 @ 1:54 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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Angel54214
Posts: 18,174
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There seems to be a large gap theory with your David Uncrazy...no geneology record that I have found; most likely a medieval fill-in...
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| Oct 23 @ 9:06 AM |
The Gap Theory
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yashaenka
Posts: 8,236
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Angel everything is not on the Internet..... 
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| Oct 23 @ 11:20 AM |
The Gap Theory |
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uncrazy
Posts: 2,382
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Angel54 offers...
There seems to be a large gap theory with your David Uncrazy...no geneology record that I have found; most likely a medieval fill-in...
I understand your response to mean that you also see a gap of time between the David that ruled from the Nile to the Euphrates promised to Abraham's line, and achieved by the David in the stories about David
...and the David that fought the Philistines.
Your note that you can find no geneology record to support two Davids...logic would tell me that it will not be found within the book that combines these two characters into a single story...for it would then clearly give away the truth that it is a composite story...lacking in historical accuracy.
We can find clear mention in the historical records and archeology(the history of the first David is cut in the stones walls of Karnak) that tells us the first men of history and when they ruled the lands from the Nile to the Euphrates as a single kingdom. The second man to do this is found in the Persian history, and named in the bible...and a geneology record shows he married the daughter of Zarubbabel, the priest/king who lead the Jews back to Jerusalem.
Your David who joined two little kingdoms of Isreal in the north and Judah in the south around 1030-970BC only sits in the midst of the 800 years separating these two great men whose lives fufilled the promise to Abraham.
A side note...this marraige created a Jewish line within the royalty of Persia.
On your note of a medieval fill-in of for the geneological record...I have seen no writer of histories in the middle ages with the skills to modify the Egyptian/Jewish components of the David story in Samuel.
I am not assuming your short response is meant to be dismissive so that the topic can be dropped. With the bible itself being the most purchased book in the world, just you and I engaging in this conversation hints how little it is read, even by bible-only-believing owners.
I am reminded of words between a historian and a Roman priest who was found to omit text found in the DSS translations...I paraphrase, "that his faith had nothing to fear from his scholarship ". His omission did not show that his faith could remain intact in the light of his studies.
Is the unwillingness for so many to study the histories due to the fear that the faith(belief without evidence) can be shaken by sholarship?
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| Oct 23 @ 11:14 PM |
The Gap Theory
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Angel54214
Posts: 18,174
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A side note...this marraige created a Jewish line within the royalty of Persia.
Perhaps faith binds in chains the good, but Ezra fills a gap of the ethnic cleansing of the house of "Judah" before her chains were released from the Babylonian birth pangs of sorrows that finally released the 40,000 Jews to praise their freedom of liberty as they marched back to the beloved city, Jeruselem upon the heart-filled repentance to their God.
Israel, thus fought long and hard the repentance to their God for faith was not a chosen saviour, for she was the 10 tribal families that remained lost until a one born from the loins of Judah called her out with simple words...follow me. She refused to accept faith as her healer in all that the Assyrian plague chained her with.
By the words from Darius' own lips did he write that all the Kingdoms he aquired were given to him freely from his own faith in a God he called Auramazda. Each Kindgom he obtained, he praised with his mouth " By the grace of Auramazda I hold this kingdom". Through all the future generations that came from the birth pangs and sorrows of Darius' dominance of cultures, there is a gap which has not ended...the discontinuance worship of Auramazda. Even all the world scholars would agree...
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| Oct 23 @ 11:22 PM |
The Gap Theory |
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j_goose
Posts: 2,911
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Needless to say...people make things more complicated than they actually are.
Nothing could be more simple than the Enuma Elish.
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