| Apr 3, 2007 @ 11:14 AM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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Martin666
Posts: 2,142
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Republican Representative Mike Pence from Indiana is visiting Baghdad now with John McCain and other congressmen, and took a walking tour of a Baghdad market to determine if the area was as safe to travel in as McCain had indicated in his previous comments about how safe the streets of Baghdad were.
At the end of the tour, Pence concluded that the Iraqi street market was “like a normal outdoor market in Indiana.”
What Pence apparently forgot to mention was the level of security needed to allow him to make that walking tour:
“The delegation arrived at the market, which is called Shorja, on Sunday with more than 100 soldiers in armored Humvees — the equivalent of an entire company — and attack helicopters circled overhead, a senior American military official in Baghdad said. The soldiers redirected traffic from the area and restricted access to the Americans, witnesses said, and sharpshooters were posted on the roofs. The congressmen wore bulletproof vests throughout their hourlong visit”
No matter how hard the ideologues may try, a round peg won't fit in a square hole.
Plus, the next time I have to travel through Indiana, I'll be sure to do my shopping in Illinois first...
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| Apr 3, 2007 @ 11:27 AM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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kattsmeow
Posts: 21,230
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It's amazing what the media doesn't show us huh? All we ever hear or see is the bad stuff that happens. Now, if I had time, I would try to find some evidence for what I said. (got to go to work,,,bummer huh)
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| Apr 3, 2007 @ 6:21 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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eastham
Posts: 6,317
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Martin, I think people may miss the sarcasm of the title of your thread.
April 2 — A day after members of an American Congressional delegation led by Senator John McCain pointed to their brief visit to Baghdad’s central market as evidence that the new security plan for the city was working, the merchants there were incredulous about the Americans’ conclusions.
“What are they talking about?” Ali Jassim Faiyad, the owner of an electrical appliances shop in the market, said Monday. “The security procedures were abnormal!”
The delegation arrived at the market, which is called Shorja, on Sunday with more than 100 soldiers in armored Humvees — the equivalent of an entire company — and attack helicopters circled overhead, a senior American military official in Baghdad said. The soldiers redirected traffic from the area and restricted access to the Americans, witnesses said, and sharpshooters were posted on the roofs. The congressmen wore bulletproof vests throughout their hourlong visit.
“They paralyzed the market when they came,” Mr. Faiyad said during an interview in his shop on Monday. “This was only for the media.”
He added, “This will not change anything.”
If you'd like to read the rest of the story: http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/03/world/middleeast/03mccain.html?_r=1&ref=world&oref=slogin
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| Apr 3, 2007 @ 6:43 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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thegoodideaman
Posts: 1,915
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At the end of the tour, Pence concluded that the Iraqi street market was “like a normal outdoor market in Indiana.”
Mission Accomplished...
Let's go home... 
(unless you live in Indiana)
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| Apr 3, 2007 @ 7:04 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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stormbay
Posts: 695
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I suppose it boils down to how long the psychopaths running this show can continue to fool the gullible, with their constant lies and deception. I believe it was only in the last couple of days that they had one of the biggest death tolls for a long time, with battles and bombs. Its also interesting to note that the supposed fortress green zone, is coming more and more under attack with at least two rocket hits a day. Six months ago they rarely got hit for weeks.
Just like Afghanistan, their winning the war over there. So they are sending more troops and you can't travel anywhere, not even in Kabul. Sounds like a good set of evidence to support, the war is won. Sounds like it has just begun to me
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| Apr 3, 2007 @ 9:54 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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eastham
Posts: 6,317
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I've read Stormbay that Karzai is really only the mayor of Kabul. It seems such a shame. They were more advanced in 1969. I recently saw a b&w photo exhibit that included pictures from 1969 Kabul. What a beautiful city and the women were wearing miniskirts (not microminis) and had Jackie Kennedy hairdos. Before the Taliban, nearly 70% of the doctors were women, the majority of the teachers were women....When they eliminated women as teachers, they didn't just ruin the lives of women and little girls, but had a tremenduous negative impact on boys.
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| Apr 4, 2007 @ 7:34 AM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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Blondino
Posts: 4,264
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Please Take a look...
Hometown Baghdad
A documentary web series following the lives of a few Iraqi 20-somethings trying to survive in Baghdad.
The everyday life of the Iraqi citizen has been the great untold story of the Iraq war 
Life in Baghdad
This is an interesting link ...The brave Iraqi subjects and crew risked their lives every time they turned on a camera to make this series. They want to show the world what life is like when your hometown is a war-zone. We believe that people who see their stories will want to share them with others. That's why we're distributing the series online. So please - watch the videos, rewatch them, tell friends about them, comment on them, and link to them.
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| Apr 4, 2007 @ 5:32 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,110
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I think McCain has lost it! We all know that people are being killed all over the place in Bagdad. McCain probably cost us some high dollars for his security while he was there and then he has the nerve to tell us it is safe.
I guess he wants us to believe the "surge" is working. They are grasping at straws all over the place, trying to find a reason to stay there that the American people will accept.
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| Apr 4, 2007 @ 5:52 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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Satellite_of_Love
Posts: 68
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They are grasping at straws all over the place, trying to find a reason to stay there that the American people will accept.
Probably because they believe defeat in Iraq will be a major disaster for both the US and especially for the future of the Iraqi people. I think we Americans are ready to cut our losses, and the day we pull out will be the day the real slaughter in Baghdad begins. When we pull out will the same humanitarians be calling for troops to go right back in to stop the Shi'ite and Sunni death squads from massacring each other? I wonder.
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| Apr 5, 2007 @ 4:04 AM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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MusicMonster
Posts: 2,954
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So then the conclusions would be we should stay there indefinitely?
The fact that we never should have been there to begin with, aside, what exactly is keeping us from pulling out? The concept that the Iraqi government cannot defend itself?? Is that it? So if it's taken over 4 years, and they still can't fight, when will they be able to? Most Basic Training for military duty takes around 8 weeks, not 4+ years!
We're being used in the worst way, to do the dirty work that they should be doing. I.e. defending themselves!! But as long as we are willing to stay as long as they want us there, per Mr. Bush, why should they ever do anything else? He can't seem to get a grip on that..
As for McCain's theatrics, that entire facade was an exercise in absurdity! And it will probably come back to bite him in his bid for the top spot.
-MM 
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| Apr 5, 2007 @ 9:41 AM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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12knots
Posts: 6,400
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The good ole US of A..... yet another country bombed and so they will leave with the bloody mess left behind. I guess the Iraqi scrap merchants are doing a grand ole trade with the expended armaments chucked around the place as did the Vietnamese.
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| Apr 5, 2007 @ 12:56 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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Satellite_of_Love
Posts: 68
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So then the conclusions would be we should stay there indefinitely?
Well, my conclusion is that if people are really concerned about the safety of Baghdad, and pulling the troops out now will undoubtedly lead to a slaughter, it's a bit contradictory.
It makes more sense to say we don't give two turds if a million Iraqis are killed, pull our troops out. That seems ot be the general concensus, tho. I think even the Iraqis would prefer a full-out civil war than to have western invaders keep them "safe." It's just their culture, imo.
the Iraq war is more about punishing the US, than saving the Iraqi people now. The UN could end the fighting almost overnight if it sent in a massive peacekeeping force, but they are willing to let more die just to teach the US a lesson about not playing by the rules. I'm not a big McCain fan, but I think he actually believes that leaving now would be disastrous to many people.
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| Apr 5, 2007 @ 5:23 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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MusicMonster
Posts: 2,954
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Well then how would you address this, as asked previously?
The fact that we never should have been there to begin with, aside, what exactly is keeping us from pulling out? The concept that the Iraqi government cannot defend itself?? Is that it? So if it's taken over 4 years, and they still can't fight, when will they be able to? Most Basic Training for military duty takes around 8 weeks, not 4+ years!
Why do you feel they shouldn't be able to fend for themselves by now? After all these years and all that money, time and lives we have funneled in there?
And when WILL they actually be able to fight for themselves? Never? Are Iraqis somehow physically less able to defend themselves, than are others?
-MM
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| Apr 5, 2007 @ 5:40 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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12knots
Posts: 6,400
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Bring back Saddam, all is forgiven.
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| Apr 6, 2007 @ 12:11 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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Satellite_of_Love
Posts: 68
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Why do you feel they shouldn't be able to fend for themselves by now? After all these years and all that money, time and lives we have funneled in there?
And when WILL they actually be able to fight for themselves? Never? Are Iraqis somehow physically less able to defend themselves, than are others?
You got me all wrong, Monster. I'm all for pulling out asap. I wouldn't sacrifice one more American troop for every Iraqi soul in that country. I'm just trying to explain why people like McCain feel we shouldn't leave yet. Pulling out now would lead to a slaughter. If you're ok with that (as I am) then just keep pulling for it. I just think that it's silly to call for the retreat for humatarian reasons. It's gonna be a bloodbath if we left now.
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| Apr 6, 2007 @ 2:25 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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Novalite
Posts: 3,009
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Violence is down according to this report. and many others.
March 16, 2007 · The U.S. military reports that deaths and murders in Iraq over the last 30 days are down by almost half. The change is being attributed to a new initiative that brings U.S. soldiers out into the streets to work with Iraqi forces. Maj. Gen. William Caldwell, the military's spokesman in Iraq, talks with Madeleine Brand.
This one is interesting.
As a result, "The marketplaces, including the book market that was targeted for an especially vicious attack, are rebuilding and doing great business. It is helping the local economy enormously to have this kind of protection in place." With jobs plentiful and demand growing, the appeal of militia armies declines proportionally.
[Edited on 4/6/2007 2:31 PM]
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| Apr 6, 2007 @ 5:57 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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Bj864
Posts: 3,110
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Pulling out now would lead to a slaughter. If you're ok with that (as I am) then just keep pulling for it. I just think that it's silly to call for the retreat for humatarian reasons. It's gonna be a bloodbath if we left now.
So then, in your opinion, what day will be the right day to leave? What will have happened to change your scenerio?
That is the question that has never been answered by anyone, that I have seen.
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| Apr 6, 2007 @ 6:58 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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stormbay
Posts: 695
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I note the fearless leader is calling up 12000 more national guards for Iraq, certainly seems like its improving, they probably need a holiday in such a peaceful calm place.
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| Apr 6, 2007 @ 7:05 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer
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Satellite_of_Love
Posts: 68
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So then, in your opinion, what day will be the right day to leave?
Tomorrow. Today. Right now.
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| Apr 6, 2007 @ 9:41 PM |
The Streets Of Baghdad Are Growing Safer |
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eastham
Posts: 6,317
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This week the brass in the Marine Corps stated that Iraq is having a profound impact on readiness. Because of the abbreviated leave, the Marines are not training sufficiently for amphibious assaults, jungle warfare...in otherwords the entire skill set. They barely have enough time to qualify their dessert groups as ready.
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