| Dec 28, 2007 @ 6:39 PM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
Blondino
Posts: 4,264
|
Who Reared The Monster ????
Throughout the world ... its agents, client states and satellites are on the defensive — on the moral defensive, the intellectual defensive, and the political and economic defensive. Freedom movements arise and assert themselves. They're doing so on almost every continent populated by man — in the hills of Afghanistan, in Angola, in Kampuchea, in Central America ... [They are] freedom fighters.” ^ ^ President Ronald Regen on the Taliban & Bin Laden 
Between 1978 and 1992, the US government poured at least US$6 billion (some estimates range as high as $20 billion) worth of arms, training and funds to prop up the mujaheddin factions. Other Western governments, as well as oil-rich Saudi Arabia, kicked in as much again. Wealthy Arab fanatics, like Osama bin Laden, provided millions more.
Washington's policy in Afghanistan was shaped by US President Jimmy Carter's national security advisor, Zbigniew Brzezinski, and was continued by his successors. His plan went far beyond simply forcing Soviet troops to withdraw; rather it aimed to foster an international movement to spread Islamic fanaticism into the Muslim Central Asian Soviet republics to destabilise the Soviet Union.
The CIA trained Osama bin Laden
and other Arabs
in the techniques of terrorism.
"Blowback" is the CIA's term for the unintended
destruction caused by its secret operations.
>>> who created the monster <<<<
In addition, there are the long-standing relations between the US government and corporate elite, particularly in big oil, and the Saudi establishment. This semi-feudal theocratic despotism, which produced bin Laden among others, has been propped up by the US for more than half a century at the expense of its own population and that of the region. The specific relations between the Bush family (as well as other members of the Bush senior inner circle, such as James Baker and Frank Carlucci)—through the Carlyle Group—and the Saudis and bin Laden family, are equally well documented. It is also a matter of public record that the FBI helped a number of the bin Ladens leave the US following the September 11 attack on a chartered 727.
Furthermore, the American role in helping consolidate the Taliban’s grip on power would be the worthy subject of a full-scale public inquiry, although not one which would receive the warm support of the Times or any other segment of the US media and political establishment. It is a fact of history that an official of the US oil company, Unocal, informed news agencies in September 1996 that an oil pipeline project would be easier to implement now that the Taliban had captured Kabul. It is also a fact that within hours of the Taliban’s conquest of Kabul, the US State Department announced it would establish diplomatic relations with the new regime (an announcement it later retracted).
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2001/dec2001/walk-d22.shtml
The British military establishment colluded with the US in supporting the mojahedin, with SAS and Green Berets going into Afghanistan itself. As ex-SAS soldier Tom Carew explains in his Andy McNab-like Jihad: The Secret War in Afghanistan (Mainstream, £7.99), they were inevitably drawn into actual combat. "We came to a small hamlet and were stopped by a couple of mojahedin. They asked us, surprisingly politely, whether we would mind helping them, as their commander had decided he was going to make some kind of stand against the Russians."
Known as the Blowback Chronicles
http://www.guardian.co.uk/afghanistan/story/0,1284,551971,00.html
in the financial world, too, there is a blowback scenario, given that for years global banking has gained considerable benefits from lack of transparency and regulation. BCCI, the British-Pakistani bank that was closed down in 1991 after a massive fraud, was a regular route for mojahedin funding, including that provided by Saudi intelligence.
Financing for Pentagon and CIA "black budget" operations - particularly in the era of William Casey - also passed through BCCI, as did drug money. Some analysts claim black-budget US and British operatives flew out opium on the planes with which they brought in arms. Later, jihad funding came from the construction-industry coffers of Osama bin Laden and other Muslim "philanthropists". Bin Laden established his own bank, the Al-Shamal Islamic, in Khartoum.
|
|
  |
|
| Dec 28, 2007 @ 6:42 PM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
Blondino
Posts: 4,264
|
http://www.msnbc.com/news/190144.asp?cp1=1
The US has become adept at creating monsters. Osama bin Laden is only the latest in a long line of US-backed despots, dictators, and criminals against humanity. Too many times to count, the US has supplied the training and support to bring into power a leader who abuses human rights, traffics drugs, demolishes democracy, or commits massacres and genocide.
The official story is that the US -- usually through the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) -- has made a series of mistakes. Backing Saddam Hussein was a mistake. Backing Manuel Noriega was a mistake. Backing the Taliban was a mistake. The CIA took a chance on these guys, and the project backfired. There's even a word for it -- "blowback."
But the leaders in question hardly started out "good" and then "turned evil." Most of these leaders were corrupt, ruthless, anti-democratic, and murderous long before they bit the US hand that fed them. Often, it was this very behavior which made them suitable candidates for support. US backing only stopped when the leader was no longer useful in achieving US aims or became "disobedient."
The stories of these infamous leaders are often surprising and always disturbing, and they offer valuable insights into the strategy behind US foreign affairs. This week, we offer accounts of five top offenders, although the list is so long that there should be many "Dishonorable Mentions."
By studying the affairs of leaders of other nations, we can learn some important lessons about the leaders of the United States -- and the kind of world they have been creating .
Gulbuddin Hekmatyar showered with money by the west 
His followers first gained attention by throwing acid in the faces
of women who refused to wear the veil. CIA and State Department
officials I have spoken with call him "scary," "vicious," "a fascist,"
"definite dictatorship material".{1 }
Looks like we are all guilty
[Edited on 12/28/2007 6:58 PM]
|
| |
|
| Dec 28, 2007 @ 7:02 PM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
iam7545
Posts: 4,151
|
bl__ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ 0
It was not Reagan - havent you seen the new film - or read the book - or watched the 2 hour special on the History Channel?
CHARLIE WILSONS WAR! Congressmen Charlie Wilson -
And btw - Bin Laden was a young punk - he had nothing to do with the mujahadeen -
Keep digging - you are a little warm! 
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 28, 2007 @ 8:17 PM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
Always_Striving
Posts: 7,592
|
Go to your dvd video center and check out the new version of a movie called: "Why We Fight".
or watch the movie here on YouTube
Part 1 of 4
Part 2 of 4
Part 3 of 4
Part 4 of 4
Michael Moore produced a well known controversial movie called: "Bowling for Columbine".
There is another movie which might raise an eyebrow or two called: "The Oil Factor".
There are so many historical political and propaganda models being utilised by the current United States presidential administration that I wonder why it isn't obvious to world citizens that the real intent of the string pullers is single world power and population management. It's the same ole sh!t on a different spoon... meaning that most of this propaganda has been tried and tested for politcal power earlier in history.
Most of our own citizens are blinded and prejudiced by our current administrations persuasive use of "a revival of the Christian moral compass".
I learned about this when I watched movies such as (So Goes The Nation, & Bush's Brain). Those movies explained the tactics which Karl Rove used to persude many United States voters into thinking that the Bush adminstration was going to be the answer and the savior to their perception of the dwindling of the Christian faith.
In reality Bush is just a snake oil salesman that fooled our nation so that he could fulfil his own self serving purposes and the obligations to the people and corporations who had helped him, his family, and his friends gain and try to maintain power throughout the world while he is in and long after he leaves office.
The poor bastards (U.S. citizens that helped put him into office) have no clue as to the price that they (and future generations) will be paying for his administrations decisions and actions.
There are many measures being taken to stupify our country (lowering the education standards and using McCarthyism style scare tactics) to convince citizens to forfeit their constitution rights so that "The Almighty and Knowlegeable" leaders will fix things for us.
Blondino, I applaud your research and suggest that you watch some of the documentary movies that I have posted. There are hundreds more of course but those are the few that I could think of at this moment relevant to this topic.
To be ignorrant is one's intellectual demise.
[Edited on 12/28/2007 8:42 PM]
|
| |
|
| Dec 28, 2007 @ 8:31 PM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
Paralegal_at_Law
Posts: 5,066
|
Whether it was:
havent you seen the new film - or read the book - or watched the 2 hour special on the History Channel?
CHARLIE WILSONS WAR! Congressmen Charlie Wilson -
Or in the alternative, was:
Washington's policy in Afghanistan was shaped by US President Jimmy Carter's national security advisor, Zbigniew Brzezinski, and was continued by his successors. His plan went far beyond simply forcing Soviet troops to withdraw; rather it aimed to foster an international movement to spread Islamic fanaticism into the Muslim Central Asian Soviet republics to destabilise the Soviet Union.
It is a diplomatic and political fact that occasionally we hold our nose and equip nogoodniks who become American proxies to fight a cold war battle, or an ongoing brushfire conflict against international criminal organizations (in the "James Bond world" they were called "SMERSH," and "SPECTER" or "CHAOS," but in real life, an example of an International Criminal Organization is AL QAEDA) or when the targets of the USA equipped nogoodniks are bona fide totalitarian world powers, what is occurring is the extension of state policy by means other than diplomacy.
During World War II, Gangland Czar Luckie Luciano, from his prison cell in Sing Sing Prison, cut a deal with the OAS and incorporated the Italian Mafia into the armed Resistance against Musolini and Hitler. His reward, after the war, was deportation to Sicily. Our reward? The defeat of Italy and Germany and a backdoor CIA relationship with the Mafia when assassins were desired.
It may be ethically questionable, but the reality is if a thug is ready, willing, and able to strike at your adversary and all that is required is to finance or equip such thugs, and the result will be the hobbling of your adversary, then the national treasury is well spent in outfitting such candidates for a constitutional letter of marque.
When we armed the Afghani resistance to fight against the Soviet occupation troops, we were doing what Moscow did for the Viet Cong guerillas, provide them with Russian-made arms to fight the Americans.
It is good policy to hold your nose and equip the enemies of your adversary. It is much better than providing military funerals for our own sons and daughters.
In retrospect, it would have been wiser for the USA to provide the Red Chinese army with the munitions that the Americans provided Chang Kai Chek and the Chinese Republican Army, because the Red Chinese Army wanted to fight the Japs and the Army of the Republic of China wanted to sit the war with Japan out.
Had we provided te Red Chinese divisions with the American-supplied equipment to see that they were "armed to the teeth" and then in an "Pacific Theater D-Day" invasion had simply air dropped the entire Red Chinese Army as airborne assault paratroopers onto the homeland Japanese Islands, the resulting hornet's nest of fanatical fighting, without quarter asked or given, would have weakened the Japanese, would have whittled down to the nubbin and fully expended the Red Chinese Army, and would have thus left a vacuum in mainland China for Chang Kai Chek and his Republic of China government to administer as the legitmate government of China, and with the elimination of the Red Chinese Army, would still have allowed America to atom bomb Hiroshima and Nakasaki and bring an end to the War in the Pacific against Imperial Japan.
To defeat one's enemies, reduce ones' adversaries, and to utilize irregular forces to one's advantage is somewhat smacking of the tactics of Machavelli, but in the final analysis, Victory, by any means necessary, is much better than defeat with Honor.
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 28, 2007 @ 8:38 PM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
lefthandedluckie
Posts: 5,023
|
Our country made the Mujahideen into the fighting force it became. We supplied mostly captured Russian, Chinese and Eastern Block weapons to them. So the Russians would not know we were doing it! That is until we uncrated the Stingers! And yes Bin Laden was there and heavily engaged! The Mujahideen started out fighting with WW I equipment until our arms started arriving!
Ronald Reagan was "the" main reason they were helped so much and it went through the CIA! Carter did start the help.
They were "Freedom Fighters"! Now, they are terrorists! After the Russians left we should have moved in and helped them. What did we do...nothing! We allowed the Taliban to grow and become what it became!
Well, you know we hurt the Russians and there was no "OIL" so why hang around!
|
| |
|
| Dec 28, 2007 @ 8:47 PM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
iam7545
Posts: 4,151
|
l_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ ie - where do you get your info from? 
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 28, 2007 @ 8:47 PM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
iam7545
Posts: 4,151
|
l_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ ie - where do you get your info from?
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 1:05 AM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
kjac
Posts: 5,484
|
l_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ ___ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ ie - where do you get your info from?
Hopefully not the Daily Mail.
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 1:10 AM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
SweetNapaGuy
Posts: 4,526
|
He got his information straight from the Pope...
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 1:15 AM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
kjac
Posts: 5,484
|
Would that be the real pope or the make-believe one the cons invented?
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 1:18 AM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
SweetNapaGuy
Posts: 4,526
|
The Avignon line of Popes. They've been incommunicado for six centuries, but their political malleability is vital for the neo-con agenda.
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 1:24 AM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
Angel54214
Posts: 13,927
|
Who really killed JFK? 
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 1:31 AM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
kjac
Posts: 5,484
|
It was the Clintonistas with assistance from the evil Weather Channel. 
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 12:35 PM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
Paralegal_at_Law
Posts: 5,066
|
Who really killed JFK?
JMO:
I believe that the motive for the JFK assassination was Kennedy's abrupt withdrawal of the naval and air support for the CIA's invasion of Cuba at the Bay of Pigs in aid of the number one foreign policy objective at the Pentagon and CIA, the elimination of the Castro communist regime. When the CIA Director and Deputy Director appealed to JFK to go back to the original plan with the naval and air support for the Pentagon equipped Cuban Expatriate CIA client paramilitary force already on the beach at the Bay of Pigs.
Kennedy opined that if the CIA had a differing foreign policy than the oval office that it was time to fire Alan W. Dulles, the Director and Gen. Charles Cabal, the Deputy Director of the CIA. He promptly did so and announced that he was going to splinter the CIA into a thousand pieces. JFK then signed an executive order transferring CIA paramilitary powers to the Joint Chiefs of Staff except during times of war.
Then RFK told J. Edgar Hoover that the Kennedys were not going to issue his Presidential waiver for him to escape mandatory federal retirement at age 65 in 1964, prior to the expiration of JFK's first term.
This effectively put Hoover, Dulles, and the General at the center of let's kill Kenndey, Inc. a conspiracy that added an ad hoc rogue group of FBI, CIA, and Pentagon associates as it grew.
BTW, the CIA Case Officer for the CIA "Operation Zapata" the invasion of Cuba starting at the Bay of Pigs was George Herbert Walker Bush, later CIA Director and President of the USA. JFK Assassination books show an FBI document showing they briefed George Bush of the CIA as to the investigation of the assassination of the President on the same day that Oswald was murdered.
President Bush says he was not with the CIA in those years prior to when he was CIA Director. He says he was in the private oil business, and guess what, he was President of the Houston based Zapata Offshore Oil Company during the Bay of Pigs Invasion. Whats offshore and in the Gulf of Mexico? Cuba. Guess the names of the ships that took the "Operation Zapata" Bay of Pigs invasion army to Cuba? The ships were named the Barbara and the Houston.
The Secret Service and the Dallas Police both say they did not know of or authorize the move of the JFK motorcade when the route was changed to go under the Texas School Book Depository sniper's window. BUT, remember the fired Deputy Director of the CIA, General Cabal? THE GENERAL'S BROTHER WAS THE MAYOR OF DALLAS!!
In the Book Coup D'Etat in America there are newspaper photographer pics of three bums taken from the Grassy Knoll trainyards by the Dallas cops immediately after the JFK shooting. These guys appear to be CIA guys Howard Hunt and Frank Sturgis and another CIA type. FYI, Hunt and Sturgis turned up later in life as the gosh for real Watergate Burglars who told the Judge at their watergate burglarsy bail hearing that their former jobs were with the CIA.
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 12:48 PM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
Gallows_Humor
Posts: 7,784
|
vey good Para...very good... and don't forget Johnson..nor the federal reserve board either......
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 2:53 PM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
iam7545
Posts: 4,151
|
kjac - it was just a few weeks ago that YOU posted a forum that revealed your complete lack of knowledge on this same issue - and then when I kindly tried to help you dug your heels in like a 6 year old that wanted more cookies.
Did YOU see the film yet? I know you won't read books.
If you are too cheap to see the film and have cable TV -
The History Channel did a great 2 hour special on how the USA funded the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan and what little role Bin Laden played in any of it. The consensus on the program was that the idea that the USA jump started Bin Laden is not based in fact. This view was expressed in interviews with Dems, Republicans an international officials.
You all can continue your doped up conspiracy theories - have fun along the way!
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 3:15 PM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
SweetNapaGuy
Posts: 4,526
|
Wow. No mention of "Charlie Wilson personally ended the Cold War"?
That's usually one of the talking points...
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 4:01 PM |
Who Created The Monster
|
|
iam7545
Posts: 4,151
|
sw_ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ y -
Whose talking point is that? The Republicans challenge the film as they want to give all credit to Reagan for the Mujahadeen Victory and ending the Cold War.
Back to the topic - this forum is suggesting that Reagan jump started Bin Laden - there is nothing farther from the truth.
|
|
| |
|
| Dec 29, 2007 @ 4:27 PM |
Who Created The Monster |
|
kjac
Posts: 5,484
|
iam, you have repeatedly revealed your willingness to flat out lie about anything and everything to prove an invalid point. But by all means please continue. It's quite amusing to listen to you of all people talk about the truth.
|
| |
|
|
|
|