| Dec 31, 2007 @ 4:42 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,865
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I was debating someone in another forum. She is a Pakistani citizen. Overall she is not a bad person and I think she made at least some attempt to get at the truth.
She admitted that -- in her words -- "95% of Pakistanis are supporting Al-Qaeda and Taliban, no doubt, I would add that I don't want you to believe that Pakistanis are peace loving, no they are not."
But I got fed up when she started in with this business about how the US needs to "understand" and be "sensitive" and study up about Islam and issues related to Islamic countries.
When people start in with that line of BS, it conveys the implication that the problem of Islamic radical terrorism is somehow our fault. And it is somehow our responsibility to stop it. That's a bunch of boloney. The problem and the responsibility of fixing it is squarely with the Islamic countries from which the terrorists come.
I'm tired of hearing this diversionary baloney that somehow we are supposed to become Islamic scholors so that we can understand why these people behave this way and what their gripes are. I DON'T WANT TO KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT ISLAM. That is the whole point! It is the Islamic radicals who want to FORCE us to have to learn about it and I will not allow them, or anyone else, to dictate what I have to know and not know.
We don't need to learn anything. It is the Islamic countries that create the terrorists who need to learn. And if they cannot learn on their own, and fix their own problem to stop the threats, I hope my country will continue to do what it needs to do to make sure we take care of it ourselves.
Here is what she wrote and my response.
She wrote:
So the need of the hour is instead of wasting precious lives, capital and time, the USA and the rest of the world should focus and study the dynamics of Pakistani state and people and work for a solution.
No, the need of the hour is for Islamic terrorists to stay the hell away from Americans or face the consequences.
I'm not interested in studying the dynamics of the Pakistani state or the gripes of the people living there. I'm only interested in protecting my family and my fellow countrymen against barbaric Islamic radicals.
I really couldn't care less what religion a person wants to practice or how they want to live. That is their business. I also have no interest whatsoever in sending Americans to Islamic countries for any reason much less to engage in violent confrontations. This notion that the United States is the aggressor is absurd. We don't want war. War was thrust upon us!
It's really simple to keep us out of your country. CLEAN UP THE TERRORIST THREAT. Until your country does that we are going to be up in your face every single day and we will clean it up ourselves if you don't.
I have no problem with anything Pakistan or any other country wants to do, or what religion they want to practice, UNTIL IT THREATENS ME, MY FAMILY OR MY COUNTRY with violence. That is the point where the line is crossed and we will not let it go without a very aggressive response.
And don't expect us to wait until more bombs go off and more of our countrymen are murdered. Islamic radical terrorists have been murdering our citizens for DECADES and we are at the end of our patience.
Stop the threat, keep your violent barbarians away from us, and there is no issue left -- we will be more than happy to leave your country alone.
No, the need of the hour is FOR THE ISLAMIC WORLD TO UNDERSTAND THIS, not the other way around.
Don't try to give us a history and theocracy lesson, we're not interested. We don't need to learn anything. We aren't the source of the problem and it is not our responsibility to fix it. It is YOUR country and other Islamic countries who are the source of this problem and you are the ones that better start learning what needs to be done to clean up your own house and shut down the threat or else we will be forced to do it for you in our own way.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 4:46 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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Gallows_Humor
Posts: 7,784
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all about you here ....( I stopped read about 1/2 way through your rant...)
my only comment is... If you want to fight with them...shouldn't you understand why they are fighting back?... 
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 4:53 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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eastham
Posts: 6,317
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No doubt, this thread will also appear as a blog, where the author of the original post will control the debate in its entirety. 
Benazir Bhutto, whom you disparaged on other threads, and the membership of the PPP are highly educated, travelled individuals who have little in common with the Taliban and their supporters. 95% of the Pakistanis do not support the Taliban. This is simply another one of your prejudiced rants.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:02 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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Blondino
Posts: 4,274
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I have a friend of a friend of a friend who said .......................................
and we should all learn from this un-named lady .... revere her views
mmmmm fairy stories or facts please 
Its like me saying . I have an American friend and he said .......................................we know americans are as diverse as Diamond Rain ... and ...... Those who are compassionate caring selfless loving human being s
[Edited on 12/31/2007 5:04 PM]
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:02 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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iam7545
Posts: 4,151
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"95% of Pakistanis are supporting Al-Qaeda and Taliban, no doubt, I would add that I don't want you to believe that Pakistanis are peace loving, no they are not."
DR - if she said that - she is wrong! If it were that bad the current situation would not exist.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:05 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,865
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@eastham et al.
Yes, I know ... anyone who has the audacity to even comment about how fed up he is with our innocent citizens being murdered and threatened by Islamic terrorism or the invasion of our country by millions of law breakers from Mexico and Central and South America is immediately branded as a racist by people on the left like you.
We are supposed to make believe that it isn't happening and, even if it is, we are supposed to make believe that we don't have any idea of where it is coming from or who is doing it. And finally, when we do identify the source, it's our fault anyway, not theirs.
Truth is strictly forbidden.
So be it. Call me anything you like. I’d rather be called a racist than let my country be destroyed.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:08 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,865
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I agree Iam, I think she overestimated it. But that is what she said.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:21 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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Blondino
Posts: 4,274
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invisible nameless friends will not be listened to until the show their faces
then we can hear their thoughts ..... until that day they are Diamonds invisible little playmates .... we al had them in childhood
show your face and we listen ....
I have a friend of a friend of a friend who was half Pakistani and she thought that maybe ... just maybe ... etc etc etc
is she here ? now ? taking questions ? no then she can get lost
When I fear to lose, I get angry.
What I am angry at, I hate.
When I hate, I, and those around me, suffer greatly.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:24 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,865
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Who cares Blondino. I posted her comment as an introduction to my point. Her comment has nothing to do with my point and what she has to say is completely irrelevant to understanding it.
Look ... I’m only going to say this once, because I don’t owe anyone any apologies.
I hate people who travel the world and intentionally look for innocent people to murder. I don’t hate people who are Islamic. Get the difference?
I don’t feel the need to explain this every time I say something for the benefit people who can’t figure it out for themselves.
.
[Edited on 12/31/2007 5:30 PM]
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:25 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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eastham
Posts: 6,317
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You used her comments to justify your comments -- not facts but opinions.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:25 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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lefthandedluckie
Posts: 5,023
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 5:48 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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Blondino
Posts: 4,274
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Who cares Blondino. I posted her comment as an introduction to my point. Her comment has nothing to do with my point and what she has to say is completely irrelevant to understanding it.
so why mention her ......... this .. invisible lady ... 
off to bed  Kisses to all invisbble ladies from Pakistan .. Selam al lekum
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 6:09 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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kjac
Posts: 5,484
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The ficticious invisible lady must have been part of the 90% of people that always seem to ficticiously agree with DR's blogs.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 6:13 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,865
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You want to talk about hate and prejudice?
Just look on the streets of Pakistan, or any of the other Crapistans. THAT is hate. They HATE us and want to cut our throats.
We are supposed to be “sensitive” to this? Who are you kidding?
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 7:55 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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Always_Striving
Posts: 7,592
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my only comment is... If you want to fight with them...shouldn't you understand why they are fighting back?...
Excellent!!! Robert McNamara discovered this same mistake waaaaaaaay too late about the cicumstances behind the Vietnam War. He admitted it in his own movie titled: The Fog Of War
11 Lessons from Vietnam
The origin of the film's lesson concept is the eleven lessons in McNamara's 1996 book In Retrospect: The Tragedy and Lessons of Vietnam:
We misjudged then — and we have since — the geopolitical intentions of our adversaries … and we exaggerated the dangers to the United States of their actions.
We viewed the people and leaders of South Vietnam in terms of our own experience … We totally misjudged the political forces within the country.
We underestimated the power of nationalism to motivate a people to fight and die for their beliefs and values.
Our judgments of friend and foe alike reflected our profound ignorance of the history, culture, and politics of the people in the area, and the personalities and habits of their leaders.
We failed then — and have since — to recognize the limitations of modern, high-technology military equipment, forces and doctrine.
We failed as well to adapt our military tactics to the task of winning the hearts and minds of people from a totally different culture.
We failed to draw Congress and the American people into a full and frank discussion and debate of the pros and cons of a large-scale military involvement … before we initiated the action.
After the action got under way and unanticipated events forced us off our planned course … we did not fully explain what was happening and why we were doing what we did.
We did not recognize that neither our people nor our leaders are omniscient. Our judgment of what is in another people's or country's best interest should be put to the test of open discussion in international forums. We do not have the God-given right to shape every nation in our image or as we choose.
We did not hold to the principle that U.S. military action … should be carried out only in conjunction with multinational forces supported fully (and not merely cosmetically) by the international community.
We failed to recognize that in international affairs, as in other aspects of life, there may be problems for which there are no immediate solutions … At times, we may have to live with an imperfect, untidy world.
Underlying many of these errors lay our failure to organize the top echelons of the executive branch to deal effectively with the extraordinarily complex range of political and military issues.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 8:47 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,865
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No, I don't want to understand them. I have no interest. I know enough about THEM already, a lot more than I want to know.
It's time for THEM TO UNDERSTAND US for a change.
And if they don't then we must MAKE THEM understand by whatever method is necessary.
We ask only one thing: Keep your terrorist threat away from us and our interests.
Instead of our trying to become experts in the finer points of the Koran and the political intricacies of some Republic of Crapistan, it's time that these countries start to become sensitive to US and learn about US and learn the consequences of THEIR behavior and the effect it will have on THEM.
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 8:59 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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lefthandedluckie
Posts: 5,023
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DiamondRain.......
and he said this..."We ask only one thing: Keep your terrorist threat away from us and our interests."......!!!
I know what the great big man is going to do...he is going over and take away their RPG's and their AK47's!
and we have a 150,000 men and 200,000 mercenaries there too!! And can't get the job done!
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 9:02 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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SweetNapaGuy
Posts: 4,526
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Most of them were just trying to live their lives in their own country. Troublesome things, national borders...
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 10:04 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn
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MusicMonster
Posts: 2,954
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Gallows said:
If you want to fight with them...shouldn't you understand why they are fighting back?...
Precisely! And well put..
As stated elsewhere, much of the problem we have with the Middle East is, little effort has been put in to understanding their culture and the reasons they think as they do. Bush in particular is very guilty of that mindset. He couldn't care less!
It's his and our shortcoming to believe they are just like us and believe just about as we do. To strategize warfare against terrorism, it is crucial to understand as much as we possibly can about the mindset which motivates it.
-MM 
[Edited on 12/31/2007 11:14 PM]
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| Dec 31, 2007 @ 10:38 PM |
What The Islamic World Needs To Learn |
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,865
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Who gives a crap about their culture?
Threaten us and you die. That is the only thing we need to understand.
So far it is working just fine thank you.
We have them so tied up in Iraq that they can't mount any more attacks on us over here. It's the perfect strategy. Muhammad Ali called it rope a dope. It's clearly a good Muslim concept. There's your cultural understanding.
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