| Jan 17 @ 8:49 AM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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MusicMonster
Posts: 2,954
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Poor guy is turning into a Big Joke!! 
Whatever happened to Separation of Church and State!!!
A lot of current problems are the result of Religious Extremism! Pushing that even more is not helpful in the least! While one's faith is fine, whatever it may be, it's a personal thing. It has no place in Government, or shoved down people's throats!!
Get a Grip HuckSter!! 
I can't believe he is even suggesting such radical ideas..
-MM 
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| Jan 17 @ 9:09 AM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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eastham
Posts: 6,317
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For the past several decades, evangelicals have been trying to rewrite history and remake US historical figures into their own image and likeness. I've seen a bit of this on the Religion thread here.
I think it goes to how poorly history is taught in the lower grades, how fearful school boards are of organized religious entities and was a firm grip these same groups have on textbook publishers. The same tactics used in the evolution/creationism/intelligent design debate.
The Founding Fathers were nearly to a man deists, with a few Unitarians thrown in for good measure. They were far more influenced by radical French philosphers like Montesquieu (the guy who dreamt up the separation of powers), Voltaire, etc than by Biblical teaching. Furthermore, coming on the heels of more than a century of religion-related warfare, they were eager to place a firewall between religion and governance -- for both their sakes.
Funny, many of the evangelicals fail to understand that their particular sects might never have come to fruitition if government and religion were more closely joined at the hip by our Founding Fathers.
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| Jan 17 @ 9:59 AM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,489
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Eastham, your words are right on about our founders. They were indeed Deist who read the OT not the NT and their set of values was based on Victorian principles from Europe. In fact some were Atheist and or Agnostics.
No where is it said or implied we are a Christian nation within the constitution, far from it. One nation under god indivisible is a pledge, not a constitutional construct. The Supreme Court has ruled that pledge is not Constitutional because of the requirement of church and state being kept separate.
Most Americans think we are a Democracy, yet we are not.
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| Jan 17 @ 10:05 AM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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Heaveninawildflower
Posts: 15,203
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One nation under god
Not to mention (again) that this part was added in the 1950's. Our original motto was "E Pluribus Unum", not "In God We Trust." I think that was changed around the same time.
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| Jan 17 @ 10:07 AM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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SweetNapaGuy
Posts: 4,526
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The pledge of allegiance was written by a socialist who wanted to turn the US into a communist utopia. It was promoted by a flag salesman who wanted a flag in every schoolhouse, courthouse, and outhouse in the country. It was altered one or two times for partisan reasons.
Not exactly the prestigious history the neo-cons assert...
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| Jan 17 @ 10:53 AM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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kattsmeow
Posts: 21,230
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I can't believe he is even suggesting such radical ideas..
Could you please post them here?
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| Jan 17 @ 11:07 AM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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iam7545
Posts: 4,151
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katts - Huck is the victim of a double standard. It is not OK to talk about Obamas Church. It is not OK to talk about Mormons. However since Huck still preaches and speaks at religious settings the liberal media follows him like a sheepdog drooling - waiting for any soundbite that they can put on MSNBC to rip him to shreds.
Of course the liberals here eat it up like mice eating cheese!
He doesnt care! It strengthens him!
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| Jan 17 @ 12:09 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,489
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Huck is preaching to the base by state to say what they want to hear just as all the candidates are.
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| Jan 17 @ 12:15 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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iam7545
Posts: 4,151
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What did he say?
Another strawman accusation?
Just what is the point here?
Do you know what he said?
A lot of current problems are the result of Religious Extremism! Pushing that even more is not helpful in the least! While one's faith is fine, whatever it may be, it's a personal thing. It has no place in Government, or shoved down people's throats!!
What problems?
Whose throat?
Pushing what?
If a man speaks in a Church what is he forcing on WHO?
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| Jan 17 @ 12:24 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,489
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A sound bite that showed him talking to the Christian right about his support for a Constitutional amendment to define what marriage is. This was what all the noise was about...
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| Jan 17 @ 12:36 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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Say_Yes
Posts: 1,779
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First of all, there is no constitutional law, to separate church and state. The courts have imposed such, in recent years, but it simply is not in the constitution, nor is it in any amendment. The two have been intertwined, since the beginning of our government. Congress (both the house and the senate) opens each session, with a prayer, just as it has done, since its first session (and as it did, during the Continental Congress). The Ten Commandments are carved into the oak doors that enter into the supreme court. There are three other renderings of the ten commandments, in the supreme court building, that have been there, since it was constructed. The president is sworn into office, with his hand placed on a bible. Should I continue to give more examples of the fact that the government, has never been separated from religion? I have given examples from all three branches of government, which have been in place, not recently, but rather continuously, since their inception.
The "establishment" clause was written to prevent the establishment of a state religion, not to separate religion, from government. At the time of the revolution, several of the colonies had official state religions and you were required to belong to a specific church, in order to be part of the government. The establishment clause was put in place to prevent this and to allow individuals the freedom to choose, which if any religion they would practice.
That being said, I find Huckabee to be a poor choice for the office of the president. There may be worse options, but none of those are likely to obtain the nomination of either party.
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| Jan 17 @ 12:37 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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iam7545
Posts: 4,151
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yash - who knows?
The OP presents nothing but a strawman?
How do you discuss a ghost or shadow?
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| Jan 17 @ 12:44 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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Say_Yes
Posts: 1,779
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Actually, MM is correct, in that Hucklebee, does want to amend the constitution, such that it aligns with his religious beliefs.
“I have opponents in this race who do not want to change the Constitution,” Huckabee told a Michigan audience on Monday. “But I believe it’s a lot easier to change the Constitution than it would be to change the word of the living god. And that’s what we need to do — to amend the Constitution so it’s in God’s standards rather than try to change God’s standards so it lines up with some contemporary view.”
Source
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| Jan 17 @ 12:54 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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iam7545
Posts: 4,151
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say yes - the link is a report about a report that some dope on MSNBC presented. We have no idea what the context was. Or who the audience was. They took a sound bite and blew it up.
Is there any doubt that MSNBC is to the left of George Soros?
They treat Billary like a Conservative!
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| Jan 17 @ 1:06 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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Say_Yes
Posts: 1,779
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say yes - the link is a report about a report that some dope on MSNBC presented. We have no idea what the context was. Or who the audience was. They took a sound bite and blew it up.
Is there any doubt that MSNBC is to the left of George Soros?
They treat Billary like a Conservative!
Don't blame the messenger. Yes, it came from MSNBC, but it is a direct quote from a speech by Hucklebee, in Michigan.
You Tube Hucklebee Speech
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| Jan 17 @ 1:11 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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iam7545
Posts: 4,151
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I am not blaming you say yes. I wonder of this is what the OP is talking about?
Who knows?
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| Jan 17 @ 1:15 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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Gallows_Humor
Posts: 7,784
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First of all, there is no constitutional law, to separate church and state. The courts have imposed such, in recent years, but it simply is not in the constitution, nor is it in any amendment. The two have been intertwined, since the beginning of our government.
all this post does is muddy the waters...
america is the land of the free...
bear with me here... (all quotes from wikki..)
E pluribus unum is a motto found on the Great Seal of the United States, along with Annuit Coeptis and Novus Ordo Seclorum, and adopted by an Act of Congress in 1782. According to the U.S. Treasury Department, "E Pluribus Unum" is Latin for "Out of Many, One".
Annuit Cœptis ...is one of two mottos (the other being Novus Ordo Seclorum) on the reverse side of the Great Seal of the United States. Taken from the Latin words annuo (nod, approve) and cœpi (begin, undertake), is literally translated as "He approves (or has approved) [our] undertakings".
The phrase Novus Ordo Seclorum (Latin for "New Order of the Ages") appears on the reverse of the Great Seal of the United States, first designed in 1782 and printed on the back of the American dollar bill since 1935. The phrase also appears on the coat of arms of the Yale School of Management, Yale University's business school. The phrase is often mistranslated as "New World Order," but the Latin for that phrase would be Novus Ordo Mundi.
now..
Separation of church and state is the political and legal idea that government and religion should be separate, and not interfere in each other's affairs. [1]
In the United States, separation of church and state is often identified with the First Amendment to the United States Constitution, which states that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof… the facts..
The phrase building a wall of separation between church and state was written by Thomas Jefferson in a January 1, 1802
"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State."
shows the intent
The idea of separating the church and state is often credited to the writings of the British philosopher John Locke, which deeply influenced the drafting of the United States Constitution.[6] According to his principle of the social contract, Locke argued that the government lacked authority in the realm of individual conscience, as this was something rational people could not cede to the government for it or others to control. For Locke, this created a natural right in the liberty of conscience, which he argued must therefore remain inviolable by any government authority. These views on religious tolerance and the importance of individual conscience, along with his social contract, became influential in the American colonies.[7]
The concept was implicit in the flight of Roger Williams from religious oppression in Massachusetts to found what became Rhode Island on the principle of state neutrality in matters of faith explains it in detail
my conclusion is.. that everyone has the free will to practice religion however they see fit or not.. but no law can be passed to say that they should.
therefore there is no intertwining in government .. but in fact ...a separation...
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| Jan 17 @ 1:40 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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Nightowl001
Posts: 4,087
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I saw the Huckabee speech where he was talking about it being easier to change the Constitution than to change the "living word of God." Obviously, Huckabee needs a few history lessons since the currently accepted version of the Bible has been changed and edited by a number of entities throughout history, without a 2/3rds Congressional majority and ratification by 37 states.
This addresses the concerns I have always had about a minister ordained in any religion being involved in public office. I am glad that Huckabee (and others) are secure enough in their faith not to question the fact that billions of other people do not believe the particular version of what Huckabee considers the "word of the living God" to necessarily be so. There are many other writings in the world regarded as holy books and, to their adherents, as "the word of God."
Huckabee's apparent stance, and those who cheer it, scare the hell out of me.
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| Jan 17 @ 1:53 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!!
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MusicMonster
Posts: 2,954
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Yash said:
A sound bite that showed him talking to the Christian right about his support for a Constitutional amendment to define what marriage is. This was what all the noise was about...
No, as defined later by Say_Yes, and only twisted all out of proportion any by the perpetual static-noise-maker, Iam, (as always, and thank God for scroll bars), this is quite a big deal with Huckabee. He literally wants to rewrite the Constitution to align with his own personal religious views. This has been all over the news. And many deem it hillarious. Hence my original reference to it becoming a joke.
Reposting Say_Yes' quote:
“I have opponents in this race who do not want to change the Constitution,” Huckabee told a Michigan audience on Monday. “But I believe it’s a lot easier to change the Constitution than it would be to change the word of the living god. And that’s what we need to do — to amend the Constitution so it’s in God’s standards rather than try to change God’s standards so it lines up with some contemporary view.”
Good definitive post later GH!! Absolutely.. The two things (Church and State) don't mesh well, as governing entities, to include that there are many many versions of religion, and a number of Americans are not religious at all, while still others are varying levels of agnostic. Nor are any required to be. But they are no less American. Generally this nation is not governed by religion. When Church controls the State, you develop scenarios such like the Middle East. And it shouldn't be that way. The USA hasn't been recently either. That which seems to be at times, is primarily just a front for the sake of image.
Neither Bush nor Cheney are good christian examples to anyone.
-MM 
[Edited on 1/17/2008 2:05 PM]
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| Jan 17 @ 2:35 PM |
Huckleberry wants to Re-Write the Constitution so it aligns with the Bible!! |
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yashaenka
Posts: 4,489
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One a President takes the oath of office he is supposed to leave his faith at the door of decision making about all government policies, he swears on the bible to uphold the constitution, and it defines that real well.
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