| Feb 14 @ 12:23 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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SeaWhitegotlost
Posts: 165
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"For the pain, suffering and hurt of these stolen generations, their descendants and for their families left behind, we say sorry."
(Kevin Rudd, February 13th, 2008)
Does Australia finally have a prime minister with the vision and compassion to treat indigenous Australians with the respect that they deserve?
Does this have wider implications for indigenous cultures in other parts of the world?
As an Australian citizen, I'd be really interested to know what others (Australians and non-Australians alike) think about this.
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| Feb 14 @ 12:48 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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MusicMonster
Posts: 2,960
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Sounds like the new Prime Minister over there has a broader scope..
I reckon it's time for that kind of pregressive change in AussyLand.. 
Good on y'all Matey!
-MM 
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| Feb 14 @ 2:59 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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Paralegal_at_Law
Posts: 5,014
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It is past time for all civilized nations to recognize the value of their native populations. By the way, although American Indian Tribes and also Alaskan Native Tribes have special status in America, the Native Hawaiian Nation has not yet obtained federal recognition as a tribe.
I have submitted proposed legislation to the US Senate in support of this oversight.
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| Feb 14 @ 4:14 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,516
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You know Democrat/Leftists just love anything that emasculates a Western power.
I don't want anyone apologizing for me because I didn't do a damn thing wrong.
White Westerners are supposed to be living in a perpetual state of guilty conscience for things some people did to some other people at some point in time in the past.
This applies even if the people who did whatever they did are no longer living and the people who had done to them what was done are also no longer living.
And it doesn't even matter if your ANCESTORS had absolutely nothing to do with whatever was done. You're guilty because you are an evil white Westerner.
Don't people ever get sick of this BS?
Let's talk about what is happening NOW...
How about demanding Al Qaeda apologize for 9/11?
How about demanding Muslims apologize for Jihadist terrorism?
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| Feb 14 @ 8:12 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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mmChocolate
Posts: 37
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Wow, this is a new experience!! I find myself agreeing with DR.
I'm Australian and I feel no need to give an apology to the Aborigines either as a group or as individuals. Those who were taken from their families without good cause have my sympathy, but not my apology because I wasn't there, We shouldn't lose sight of the fact too that many children were removed (rescued) with very good cause and for their own benefit - to have not acted in many instances would have been an appalling negligence. Should we perhaps also be saying sorry to those who were not rescued?
I feel sympathy for the plight of Aborigines generally, wish to see their lot greatly and immediately improved, and support government efforts to achieve that outcome. I believe our government should devote more resources to that end. But those feelings have nothing to do with what happened in decades long passed - it's simply that they're Australians, no more or less so than myself, and they deserve their equal share of the prosperity our country enjoys.
Mr Rudd wasn't speaking for me yesterday.
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| Feb 14 @ 8:35 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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Nightowl001
Posts: 3,470
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I think your prime minister has taken a bold step toward trying to recognize what happened to the Aborigines and admitting that people from "his" world were responsible. No, of course most of us currently alive weren't part of those opressive colonial movements that oppressed the peoples of an entire continent. But just as we weren't there to commit those atrocities, our forefathers aren't here now to apologise for them. There is nothing emasculating about saying, "My people were wrong to do that to your people. We apologise."
In both, the United States and Australia, the indigenous peoples were opressed and discriminated against as official policy for many generations. Those policies and attitudes kept those peoples from advancing to the degree they should have in matters of self determination. At the very least, even if they have an equal voice now, they are starting from behind the line where the others are standing, in a position they were forcibly restricted to in the past (sometimes the not-so-recent past). There is nothing emasculating about saying "Yes, we should be equal, and because my people have social and economic advantages your people don't have, because of what my people did to your people for generations, we wish to do something to try to make amends and to bridge the gap." Next, "What is it you would like us to do?" is a good point for starting negotiations.
Kudos to PM Rudd for taking a courageous first step.
[Edited on 2/14/2008 8:39 PM]
[Edited on 2/14/2008 8:40 PM]
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| Feb 14 @ 8:36 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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blueyes101
Posts: 8,230
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Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
Ok, and that and $10 will get ya an expensive cup of coffee. 
Have you ever told somebody you had a flat tire ? And they said........... I'm sorry..... Does it really make you feel any better? Does it change the days events?
Does Australia need to apologize for their ancestors being criminals? Does Britain need to apologize for shipping them there ?
I don't get it........ Can you imagine two Aborigines sitting there, and ones tells the other...... The second one says...... Now what......... and the other says....... No thats it !!!!!!!!!
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| Feb 14 @ 9:59 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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lefthandedluckie
Posts: 4,259
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I was in Australia in 1970 for about 30 days. I did get to see the Native People of your land! One thing really impressed me about those people. It was their ability to hunt food. Plus, what they used for weapons. Simply amazing!
I was informed back then that the white Aussies used to hunt,years and years before, the Native Peoples like they were an animal. A really barbaric state of affairs let me tell'ya! And we used to treat our blacks, we imported for slave labor, as they had no rights at all!
Yes, it is a great thing what that P.M. did. And I hope he follows up with everything at his disposal to help his people. You do know they are his people just like the whites are elsewhere! But, I know you know....I read your profile!
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| Feb 15 @ 2:49 AM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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SeaWhitegotlost
Posts: 165
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Don't people ever get sick of this BS?
Let's talk about what is happening NOW...
Oh but, Diamond Rain, we are talking about what’s happening now. According to the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare,
Life expectancy is not uniform across populations within Australia. Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples have a much lower life expectancy than the general Australian population. Indigenous Australians born in the period 1996-2001 are expected to live nearly 20 years less than the rest of the population .
(ABS 2005. Deaths Australia, 2004. ABS Cat. No. 3302.0. Canberra: ABS).
This shows that ill-health and early death continue to be what Aboriginal Australians can typically expect in the country that their ancestors have inhabited for thousands and thousands of years. As you can see, this statistic relates specifically to children under 12 years old. You can’t get much more “NOW” than that.
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| Feb 15 @ 3:39 AM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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MusicMonster
Posts: 2,960
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I believe there's something to be said for the feeling that a current generation has no business "apologizing" for things they had nothing to do with, occurring generations in the past. After all, one can't really apologize for something you didn't have anything to do with.
Having said that though, I think recognizing and making amends for mistakes made in generations past is a very good thing, and over and above all else, equality should rule, from here on.
With human beings, imperfect as we are, in making corrections for wrongs of the past, the pendulum usually over-swings, and that's just as bad as the older ways. So that should be observed and avoided. But it should be emphasized that every human being deserves every right and privilege that all other demographics enjoy. No more and certainly no less. As such every existing opportunity should be available to the Aborigine populous as well as all others.
-MM
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| Feb 15 @ 4:36 AM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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SeaWhitegotlost
Posts: 165
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I see what you're saying, Music Monster, about not apologizing for things we didn't do but (as you go on to say) ...
recognizing and making amends for mistakes made in generations past is a very good thing, and over and above all else, equality should rule, from here on.
I think Night Owl puts it beautifully when he says ...
But just as we weren't there to commit those atrocities, our forefathers aren't here now to apologise for them. There is nothing emasculating about saying, "My people were wrong to do that to your people. We apologise."
And yes, I definitely agree that Rudd's initiative has as much to do with the future as with the past. It's to be hoped that he and his government will follow up effectively on what they have started.
I personally had nothing to do with the policies behind the Stolen Generation or with any of the other atrocities perpetrated on indigenous Australians. I wasn't there then and neither were any of my ancestors. However, for me, it's about showing solidarity, support and understanding to a dispossessed, neglected and alienated people. It's also about acknowledging that their belief, their practices and their right to the land go back tens of thousands of years.
If it helps these remarkable people to live longer, be happier and enjoy the same benefits of "the lucky country" that other Australians enjoy I, for one, am not too proud to say sorry.
[Edited on 2/15/2008 4:46 AM]
[Edited on 2/15/2008 4:48 AM]
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| Feb 15 @ 7:43 AM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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eastham
Posts: 5,963
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This isn't simply about apologizing for acts committed by the "founding fathers" of Australia, but also about acts committed during the lifetime of everyone who has posted on this thread. The "Stolen Generation" refers to acts by the Australian government in the 1960's to remove aboriginal children from their parents and make them all wards of the state.
I concur with Nightowl's statement that their is nothing emasculating about saying I'm sorry.
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| Feb 15 @ 8:35 AM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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SeaWhitegotlost
Posts: 165
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Absolutely right, Eastham.
Many injustices happened, as you say, in our lifetimes - well, certainly in mine ...
In addition to what the "Stolen Generation" suffered, Aboriginal Australians were not even counted in the national census until 1971.
I agree, a lot of what we are saying sorry for happened in living memory.
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| Feb 15 @ 2:26 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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DiamondRain
Posts: 4,516
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I remember hearing a story about a WWII German Nazi officer who was on his deathbed.
If I remember correctly it was Elli Weisel, a Jewish holocaust survivor who dedicated his life's work to chronicling the Nazi atrocities who was interviewing this guy as he laid dying.
Throughout the entire interview, it was clear that the Nazi was cooperating with Weisel because he wanted to relieve his conscience of the horrific crimes against humanity that he had committed.
Weisel dutifully took notes and asked questions in great detail over the course of a very long interview.
At the end of the interview, the Nazi was in tears. He asked Weisel if he forgave him.
Weisel replied that it was not up to him to forgive and so he could not. Only the people that the Nazi had killed would be entitled to grant him forgiveness, and they are all gone.
When you are wronged in such an egregious way, an apology is meaningless.
And an apology made on behalf of those who have done no wrong is not only meaningless, it is a violation of the rights of those from whom the apology is inappropriately issued.
There is a big difference between sympathy and apology.
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| Feb 15 @ 3:50 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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mmChocolate
Posts: 37
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I don’t accept the proposition that there’s nothing emasculating in saying “I’m sorry”. It’s an unwarranted admission of guilt.
There’s no question the Aboriginal people have been slighted and they deserve our sympathy and our assistance but a disingenuous apology is insulting to everyone, especially the injured party. The better, and more Australian way would be to say simply “Can I give you a hand mate?”. And act.
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| Feb 15 @ 3:57 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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mmChocolate
Posts: 37
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Paralegal said:
I have submitted proposed legislation to the US Senate in support of this oversight.
One hopes someone else actually drafted the legislation.
[Edited on 2/15/2008 4:03 PM]
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| Feb 15 @ 3:59 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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SeaWhitegotlost
Posts: 165
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According to Michael Mansell, spokesman for the National Aboriginal Alliance, members of the Stolen Generation will be relieved to hear the word "sorry" spoken. (AP)
However, there are certainly those who, like Diamond Rain, are sceptical about the step that Kevin Rudd has taken. The Aboriginal leader Noel Pearson, for example, has criticised it because it wasn't accompanied by a promise of financial compensation. (The Australian)
Hopefully, time will show that Kevin Rudd's historic words have real substance behind them and Aboriginal Australians will one day have their fair share of everything "the lucky country" has to offer.
The road to a better life for Aboriginal Australians will indeed be a long one but should we really condemn Kevin Rudd for taking one small step along it?
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| Feb 15 @ 4:38 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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Nightowl001
Posts: 3,470
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I must admit that I was unfamiliar with the "Lost Generation" of Aborigines. In light of just what I have read in this thread about that, it makes PM Rudd's efforts to extend an apology and open negotiations about what can be done to make amends even more brave, as I suspect there are still many who think they were probably right in those policies yet.
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| Feb 15 @ 4:43 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ...
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eastham
Posts: 5,963
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The Lost Generation reminded me of what happened to the Roma in various countries in Europe.
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| Feb 15 @ 5:09 PM |
Australia apologizes to the Aborigines ... |
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SensualGemini
Posts: 3,052
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I am going to delete this as being too far off topic... sorry OP.
[Edited on 2/15/2008 6:34 PM]
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