| Feb 17 @ 12:15 PM |
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Gallows_Humor
Posts: 7,784
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The DNC purports to overide the Michigan and Florida election laws by refusing to seat the Democrats elected as delegates to the Democratic National Convention.
the state determined when their people would vote in a federal election based on what the state wanted...not what the rules that they needed to abide by were..so the law is mute .and not enforceable.. remember that this was not a state election... 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ContractCivil law systems take the approach that an exchange of promises, or a concurrence of wills alone, rather than an exchange in valuable rights is the correct basis. So if you promised to give me a book, and I accepted your offer without giving anything in return, I would have a legal right to the book and you could not change your mind about giving me it as a gift. However, in common law systems the concept of culpa in contrahendo, a form of 'estoppel', is increasingly used to create obligations during pre-contractual negotiations.[10] Estoppel is an equitable doctrine that provides for the creation of legal obligations if a party has given another an assurance and the other has relied on the assurance to his detriment. A number of commentators have suggested that consideration be abandoned, and estoppel be used to replace it as a basis for contracts.[11] However, legislation, rather than judicial development, has been touted as the only way to remove this entrenched common law doctrine. Lord Justice Denning famously stated "The doctrine of consideration is too firmly fixed to be overthrown by a side-wind."[12] See also: Consideration under English law and Consideration under American law [edit] Intention to be legally bound There is a presumption for commercial agreements that parties intend to be legally bound. On the other hand, many kinds of domestic and social agreements are unenforceable on the basis of public policy,
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| Feb 17 @ 10:10 PM |
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lefthandedluckie
Posts: 5,023
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Why is a republican/independent/unicyclist/or whatever he claims to be for this thread, even caring about how the Democrats pick delegates? Why should he even want to run off and gaggle about anything but hating a Democrat?
Boy, you really pull the pudding on this one! Had to put your republican 2 cents in, huh?
Well, go right ahead as you have already but, what you say doesn't amount to a big pile of steaming horse hockey! 
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| Feb 17 @ 10:30 PM |
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Nightowl001
Posts: 4,087
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The DNC purports to overide the Michigan and Florida election laws by refusing to seat the Democrats elected as delegates to the Democratic National Convention.
This is getting tedious, Para. You can cite the statutes that were over-ridden?
Caucuses are notoriously slanted toward activists who turn out in favor of a candidate and are often scheduled in such a way that many people are not allowed to participate. In fact, in some states, if you aren't a registered Democrat you can't participate in the Democratic primary. Their is no "fairness" or "equal opportunity of access" clause regarding the primaries that I am aware of.
Each party is free to run their nominating process as they see fit. The DNC can do whatever they want with those "delegates," including not seating them. If enough Democrats are bothered by that idea, perhaps they will change their registration to "Independent" next time around. But I really doubt there are any laws in Florida or Michigan (or any other state) stating that the DNC has to accept certain delegates to the convention apportioned by the votes in that state. If they had such, most of the Republican conventions would be in violation of such laws, because few of the Republican primaries result in apportioned delegates, but are rather "winner takes all" states.
Use some common sense.
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| Feb 20 @ 11:00 AM |
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Paralegal_at_Law
Posts: 5,066
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Use some common sense.
There are five elements to a contract: meeting of the minds, consideration, competency, duration, and lawful purpose.
The lawful purpose clause indicates that when a private relationship violates a public law, the agreement is void on its face.
Use some common sense.
When the DNC refuses to seat delegates that were chosen by election pursuant to law, that private organization puts itself ABOVE THE LAW.
It appears to me that the rules of the DNC violate public policy and are in violation of the public laws of sovereign states. Obviously, none of the Michigan or Florida Electoral College votes should be eligible for the Democrats in the November General Election, as a sanction.
Those two states should convene their legislature and rewrite their election laws to ban the Democrats from enjoying any Electoral votes from their states.
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| Feb 20 @ 11:12 AM |
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Nightowl001
Posts: 4,087
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It appears to me that the rules of the DNC violate public policy and are in violation of the public laws of sovereign states.
Of course, as usual, there is no statute cited that says who the Democratic National Committee has to seat at the convention to chose THEIR candidate for President.
I said before, anyone who doesn't like it is free to wander off and be a Republican, or a Libertarian, or a Green Party member, or any other damned thing.
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| Feb 20 @ 11:14 AM |
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Gallows_Humor
Posts: 7,784
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sorry para..but your post shows that you are not versed in contract law...
all of the five need to be there and in place to have an iron clad contract..miss one or more of the four and the contract can be broken..
but..... if the contract is not for a legal purpose... the contract is null and void..no if's and's or but's..
The lawful purpose clause indicates that when a private relationship violates a public law, the agreement is void on its face. is true.. but the states cannot say that it was illegal to not seat the delegates..as they violated the original contract when they changed the voting date.. therefore.a new contract would have to be entered into..
and the DNC stated, to these two states...thanks but no thanks..you are still democrats for the November election based on state laws.. but you no longer belong to the national organization the contract we had is now no longer valid as we no longer have a meeting of the minds...based on your not following the terms agreed upon... 
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| Feb 20 @ 12:02 PM |
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iam7545
Posts: 4,151
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It is a moot point now! Obama will get enough votes to win the nomination.
Billary can get the hankie now.
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| Feb 20 @ 12:06 PM |
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pamdemonium
Posts: 14,503
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The dems can get the hankie. If Obama gets the nomination or not, he's not going to win. This is the dems election to lose this time around.
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| Feb 20 @ 12:08 PM |
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kjac
Posts: 5,484
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Either way, America wins. Bush will be gone, and the two worst possible candidates (Clinton and Guiliani) won't be there.
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| Feb 20 @ 12:10 PM |
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budo13
Posts: 3,083
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 Kjac we are agreeing to much
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| Feb 20 @ 12:18 PM |
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kjac
Posts: 5,484
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Obama vs. McCain I won't vote for McCain, but I'd rather see him win than Hillary. I wasn't all that nervous about Rudy though. I was never under the impression he had a chance in hell.
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| Feb 20 @ 2:19 PM |
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pamdemonium
Posts: 14,503
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He certainly had a better chance back in the earliest days after 9/11.
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| Feb 20 @ 2:28 PM |
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MotownManiax
Posts: 7,881
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I was one of those Michigan voters that got screwed with all the Dem party shenanigans and petulance. If I had a choice I would have voted for Obama, but since he wasn't on the ballot I ended up voting for McCain.
Unfortunately, there's no way to factor in my "almost" vote if the national committee decides to change their minds and allow Michigan/Florida in afterall.
The Dems sure know how to shoot themselves in the foot. 
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| Feb 20 @ 2:32 PM |
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pamdemonium
Posts: 14,503
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With a higher majority of registered voters being dems, and still, not being able to find an electable candidate, I'd have to agree with you. It means they're not even voting for their own candidate.
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| Feb 20 @ 2:48 PM |
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MotownManiax
Posts: 7,881
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Yep, Pammie. Two states that got left out of the process and now just adding to the whole, confused mess.
Side note: People may dislike the Republican process of winner of take all for each state, but if the Dems had it there'd be no need to worry about Super Delegates and other nonsense. At least you'd have one clear winner at the end.
 Mo
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| Feb 20 @ 2:53 PM |
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pamdemonium
Posts: 14,503
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Mo- I love it when you talk nerdy to me.  
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| Feb 20 @ 2:54 PM |
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MotownManiax
Posts: 7,881
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| Feb 20 @ 2:56 PM |
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Heaveninawildflower
Posts: 15,203
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At least you'd have one clear winner at the end.
Um...not necessarily, unless we add a tiebreaker state 
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| Feb 20 @ 4:40 PM |
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MotownManiax
Posts: 7,881
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like in tennis?
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| Feb 21 @ 7:02 PM |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,110
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All I know is that I"M ANGRY! I am fed up with my vote being taken away from me.
I think the State of Florida was wrong in what they did. They KNEW it was against the rules of of the DNC. In spite of the rules though the DNC has now allowed the GOP to really put one over on them, so I am angry at them too!
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