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the VP debate...


Oct 3 @ 2:00 PM the VP debate...    
Gallows_Humor


Posts: 8,063
with the facts..and only the facts....

what they did wrong....


http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/factchecking_biden-palin_debate.html
Biden and Palin debated, and both mangled some facts.

Palin mistakenly claimed that troop levels in Iraq had returned to “pre-surge” levels. Levels are gradually coming down but current plans would have levels higher than pre-surge numbers through early next year, at least.
Biden incorrectly said “John McCain voted the exact same way” as Obama on a controversial troop funding bill. The two were actually on opposite sides.


Palin repeated a false claim that Obama once voted in favor of higher taxes on “families” making as little as $42,000 a year. He did not. The budget bill in question called for an increase only on singles making that amount, but a family of four would not have been affected unless they made at least $90,000 a year.
Biden wrongly claimed that McCain “voted the exact same way” as Obama on the budget bill that contained an increase on singles making as little as $42,000 a year. McCain voted against it. Biden was referring to an amendment that didn't address taxes at that income level.
Palin claimed McCain’s health care plan would be “budget neutral,” costing the government nothing. Independent budget experts estimate McCain's plan would cost tens of billions each year, though details are too fuzzy to allow for exact estimates.


Biden wrongly claimed that McCain had said "he wouldn't even sit down" with the government of Spain. Actually, McCain didn't reject a meeting, but simply refused to commit himself one way or the other during an interview.

Palin wrongly claimed that “millions of small businesses” would see tax increases under Obama’s tax proposals. At most, several hundred thousand business owners would see increases.

For full details on these misstatements, and on additional factual disputes and dubious claims, please read on to the Analysis section.

knowing this is what they did wrong...i(your)ho... what did they do right?

I think Biden was palabum here.. but that was all he had to do as Sarah was the one that needed to sing..

I did like the fact that his projected role in the administration was better defined...

Sarah did a really good job getting her message across and side stepping the issues that she was weak on or that her position would not sit well with the voters..

grading on a curve.. I gave sarah a B- C+ Biden a solid B

JMHO here...what is yours?

( please for this one time.. try to not attack/debate other people's opinion here and just give your opinion as a stand alone. post......

posting facts..( not other peoples opinion ) to counter another post should still be ok....





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Oct 3 @ 2:16 PM the VP debate...    
Loreli


Posts: 20,315
I would give Biden a B and Palin a C.

But she did better than I thought.

They both did.
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Oct 3 @ 2:19 PM the VP debate...    
kattsmeow


Posts: 21,272
The reason I give it to Palin is because I founf Sen Biden kinda boring. Typical white, older man, been in the senate too long kinda guy.
I never doubted that Sen Biden would know his stuff. He has been around for a bit.


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Oct 3 @ 5:09 PM the VP debate...    
Gman762


Posts: 3,291
The Wall Street Journal’s Peggy Noonan: (an unbiased reporter)

She killed. It was her evening. She was the star. She had him at, ‘Nice to meet you. Hey, can I call you Joe?’ It was very interesting to me, for Palin tonight, for an hour and a half, I think America saw her for a really long time, and she became a star probably on a new level. Gwen Ifill was not there for Sarah Palin. Joe Biden was not there for Sarah Palin. Sarah Palin was there with a camera. It was classic go over the heads of the media and everybody else, talk straight to the American people. She hit every populist chord. It is amazing to me that 15 minutes in, she had Joe Biden on the defensive on the subject of Obama and taxes. … She killed.”

Noonan on Video

(NBC’s “Vice Presidential Debate Coverage,” 10/2/08)

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Oct 3 @ 5:09 PM the VP debate...    
Gman762


Posts: 3,291
Factcheck is hardly an unbiased source...
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Oct 3 @ 9:56 PM the VP debate...    
lefthandedluckie


Posts: 5,081
gaman and the well street journalizer is totally biased towards the rethuglican pary and big corporations!

ending my class on civics...gaman failed the course as per usual!
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Oct 4 @ 9:57 AM the VP debate...    
Kenn159


Posts: 2,774
Rupard Murdock owns the Wall Street Journal, he is the same right wing wack job that owns Fox.
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Oct 4 @ 10:09 AM the VP debate...    
eastham


Posts: 6,341
This would be the same Peggy Noonan, who when she thought the microphones were turned off, went off on what a mistake Palin was, that the choice was in the realm of the "political bullsh^t of narratives" and stating emphatically Palin was not the most qualified woman McCain could have picked.YouTube link.
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Oct 4 @ 10:13 AM the VP debate...    
Gman762


Posts: 3,291
Sucks when she sings a different song after seeing Palin in action, eh Easterham?

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Oct 4 @ 10:31 AM the VP debate...    
yashaenka


Posts: 4,572
First of all the forum of this debate limited one severely in presenting actual facts with any disclaimer to define what he or she meant with their response.

The 2nd thing a VP debate is only meant to depict what their own leaders view and opinion is and to discount their opponents view point is.

It all boils down to this by an independent monitoring organization Biden is the 3rd most liberal as ranked Obama the 1st ranked most liberal by their voting records. Liberal equates to tax and spend the government acts like the father from birth to death.

Biden made over 18 faux paus Sarah made only one gross one by getting the general in Afghanistan name wrong. She corrected that yesterday on Fox.

Biden starts off being a twice self admitted plagiarizer and the number 1 in the Senate with the most guffaes. From a delivery and connection with the American people it was hands down a Sarah win.

Obama has very little actual experience actually a lot less than Sarah has. Being a Legislator is not an Executive position, being a Governor with a successful tract record is.

Biden does not pass the common sense rule Sarah does.
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Oct 4 @ 10:35 AM the VP debate...    
Novalite


Posts: 3,093
I did like the fact that his projected role in the administration was better defined.

He pulled his definition out of his a$$. He should go and read the constitution sometime as he defined it wrong and Palin was right.

35 years and a five week wonder shows him up.

Link

Democratic vice presidential nominee Sen. Joseph R. Biden Jr. appeared to incorrectly outline the constitutional role of the job he's seeking in Thursday's debate.

In attacking Vice President Dick Cheney, Mr. Biden said the vice president's only role is to support the president and to preside over the Senate "only in a time when in fact there's a tie vote. The Constitution is explicit."

The Constitution, though, actually says the vice president is always president of the Senate and legal scholars say he has the right to preside at any time. Early vice presidents, such as Thomas Jefferson, actively exercised that role, the vice president still keeps offices at the Capitol, and scholars say it wasn't until the middle of the 20th century that the vice president had an office at the executive office building.

The president pro tempore, usually the senior senator from the majority party, takes over only when the vice president is absent. In recent practice, as the vice president has taken a bigger role in the executive, that's meant the Senate operates almost all of the time without the vice president in the chair.

The Obama campaign didn't return a message for comment left late Thursday, after the debate.

For her part Republican vice presidential nominee Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin said she plans to take the vice president's role of president of the Senate seriously.

"I'm thankful the Constitution would allow a bit more authority given to the vice president if that vice president so chose to exert it in working with the Senate and making sure that we are supportive of the president's policies and making sure too that our president understands what our strengths are," she said.

Mr. Biden, who's been in the Senate for three decades, also mistakenly stated that the executive branch is defined in Article I of the Constitution. In fact, Article I describes the legislature, while Article II lays out the executive.
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Oct 4 @ 10:56 AM the VP debate...    
Nightowl001


Posts: 4,134
Sucks when she sings a different song after seeing Palin in action, eh Easterham?
Wow... A two-fer....defending two lying two-faced backstabbing hypocritical women in one statement! Everybody's is 'Cuda's friend until they don't ask "How high?" when she says "Jump!" Noonan pegs her (off-mike), but, oh fer sure, let's not smear the pitbull's lipstick while the camera's running. After all, she's the new GOP Cover Girl. Body by Fisher.. primed, painted and clear-coated. Brains by Mattel. Hell, Chatty Cathy had more different lines than Palin.
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Oct 4 @ 11:16 AM the VP debate...    
Kenn159


Posts: 2,774
It all boils down to this by an independent monitoring organization Biden is the 3rd most liberal as ranked Obama the 1st ranked most liberal by their voting records.

As much as you neocons would love to make "liberal" a four letter word, It doesn't work anymore.
After eight years of the same physiological manipulation, most people can smell your stink and see through the fear tactics.
Most liberal?
That’s an asset.




Liberal equates to tax and spend the government acts like the father from birth to death.

George Bush presides over the largest government expansion and largest deficit in the history of this country.
Republicans are the party of wasteful big government and zero fiscal restraint.
The conservative party today is anything but "conservative."
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