| Oct 30, 2008 @ 6:40 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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burnslikethesun
Posts: 13,027
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Fact Check: Goggle Palin's Alaska spreads its wealth Youll find it.
Palin's Alaska spreads its wealth
Republicans John McCain and Sarah Palin summon antidemocratic images of a communist state to attack Democrat Barack Obama's tax plan and his comment about spreading the wealth around. But in her home state, Palin embraces Alaska's own version of doing just that.
Palin and McCain seized on a comment Obama made to Ohio plumber Joe Wurzelbacher, who asked about his tax plans.
Obama wants to raise taxes on families earning $250,000 to pay for cutting taxes for the 95 percent of workers and their families making less than $200,000. "I think when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody," he told Wurzelbacher.
McCain said that sounds "a lot like socialism" to many Americans. Palin has derided the Illinois senator as "Barack the Wealth Spreader."
But in Alaska, Palin is the envy of governors nationwide for the annual checks the state doles out to nearly every resident, representing their share of the revenues from the state's oil riches. She boosted those checks this year by raising taxes on oil.
A look at Palin's and McCain's comments and the record in Alaska:
THE SPIN:
"Barack Obama calls it spreading the wealth. Joe Biden calls higher taxes patriotic," Palin told a crowd in Roswell, N.M., and elsewhere. "But Joe the Plumber and Ed the Dairyman, I believe they think it sounds more like socialism.
"Friends, now is no time to experiment with socialism."
In Ohio, she asked, "Are there any Joe the Plumbers in the house?" To cheers, she said, "It doesn't sound like you're supporting Barack the Wealth Spreader."
McCain told a radio audience that Obama's plan "would convert the IRS into a giant welfare agency, redistributing massive amounts of wealth at the direction of politicians in Washington."
"Raising taxes on some in order to give checks to others is not a tax cut; it's just another government giveaway." Edited to state source, sorry, I ain't posting a link do to that I am personally signed in a private account site. And with all you stalkers Ashley Todd I know youre watchin, it aint the risk. 
[Edited on 10/30/2008 8:21 PM]
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 6:41 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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burnslikethesun
Posts: 13,027
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THE FACTS:
In Alaska, residents pay no income tax or state sales tax. They receive a yearly dividend check from a $30 billion state investment account built largely from royalties on its oil. When home fuel and gas costs soared this year, Palin raised taxes on big oil and used some of the money to boost residents' checks by $1,200. Thus every eligible man, woman and child got a record $3,269 this fall.
She also suspended the 8-cent tax on gas.
"We can afford to share resource wealth with Alaskans and to temporarily suspend the state fuel tax," she said at the time.
Much as Obama explains his tax hike on the rich as a way to help people who are struggling, Palin's statement talked about the energy costs burdening Alaskans:
"While the unique fiscal circumstances the state finds itself in at the end of this fiscal year warrant a special one-time payment to share some of the state's wealth, the payment comes at a time when Alaskans are facing rising energy prices. High prices for oil are a double-edged sword for Alaskans. While public coffers fill, prices for heating fuel and gasoline have skyrocketed over the last six months and are now running into the $5- to $9-a-gallon range for heating fuel and gasoline across several areas of the state."
In an interview with The New Yorker last summer Palin explained that she would make demands of a new gas pipeline "to maximize benefits for Alaskans":
"And Alaska we're set up, unlike other states in the union, where it's collectively Alaskans own the resources. So we share in the wealth when the development of these resources occurs." Republicans will listen to any tool that is willing to simply share their label.  There's a straight talking commie if ya need to know what one looks like.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 6:52 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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vinnytmd
Posts: 6,004
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burns, you are presenting an apple to compare to an orange here.
Barry's "share the wealth" is Marxism as he wants the rich to give to the poor and non taxpaying citizens.
What Palin did was rightfully tax Oil Companies that use her States natural resources and then returned it to the people. The previous deal with the Oil Companies were struck with some corrupt politicians.
What she did was what government should do, return windfalls to the people and not dream up useless ways to spend it.
All Alaskans got the same amount of money.
In the recent past many local governments realized huge windfalls when property values and taxes went through the roof.
Most municipalities spent it all.
[Edited on 10/30/2008 6:59 PM]
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 6:57 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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Bj864
Posts: 3,960
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Spreading the wealth is DONE BY BOTH PARTIES.
The republicans spread it upwards.
The democrats spread it downward.
The question is only which way do you want the wealth to go?
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 7:21 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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burnslikethesun
Posts: 13,027
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Vin. Im just reporting what the AP has to offer.
Which is ya know is FactCheck. Not really known for their mixing of apples and oranges.
Is this just more its a good idea so we are gonna rip it off call it something else all the while shaming you for it, as this article is reporting.
This typical double standard being out out played.
Everything I have read and heard come from Obama and his camp has never been he wants the rich to give to the poor and non taxpaying citizens.
He wants to make the tax code a little more fair. Nothing wrong with fair now is there.
Non tax paying, you mean illegals which he not giving them anything but a chance at a shot at becoming legal citizens, paying their taxes to collect their benefits in the end. Or the unemployed that need the help the most?
Only time I ever hear Marxist is coming from the republican camp, usually with some fear shouting of this is the end of the free world!!!
Republican think that democrats hold Obama as the second coming of the Messiah, again not true. That we believe he will make the criple walk and the blind see. More blown up opinion, not fact.
We know this isn't so, for if he was the second coming of christ the WBC and all the other republican wing nut religious groups would be supporting him, and not the Democrats. What we do believe is that the up hill climb that every American needs to make to better themselves should be on a little more even and fairer ground.
So what the word one would use when they take from the poor and give to the rich? Wall street bail out?
On a side note, and personal point of interest. Find anymore news on the early voting winners losers? Been reading news most of my free time today and I haven't came across anything yet.
Hey look all an actual civil pose and report. We all can so rock when we decide to lay down the insults.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 7:38 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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vinnytmd
Posts: 6,004
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burns - you need to site your sources when you quote.
I know more about communism and socialism than you will ever know by reading a book. I lived in Italy until I was 10. The best areas have 10% unemployment and the worst 20-30%. This is in good times. If Barry gets elected he will make Carter look like Abe Lincoln.
Barry and the Democrats seem to emulate the European lifestyle. He is the epitome of a Marxist intellectual who preaches one thing while living like a king.
I can smell a Marxist a mile away burns.
Here is what Barry said to Joe the Plumber
"It's not that I want to punish your success. I just want to make sure that everybody who is behind you, that they've got a chance for success too," Obama responded. "My attitude is that if the economy's good for folks from the bottom up, it's gonna be good for everybody ... I think when you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody."
Barry's tax plan will give money to non tax paying people - WELFARE!
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 8:03 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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Novalite
Posts: 3,253
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To put it in perspective to tax a company that is taking resources from your state is fine as if they won't pay, another company will. It's a cost of doing business and, that decision to increase their tax comes with a study on whether or not they can afford it and still be profitable and determining if they will go someplace else to set up operations. Given that the oil in Alaska is not anywhere else it is fair game to increase taxes as that company cannot simply move to Maine and expect to turn a profit hence, they paid.
On the other hand, stealing money from somebody who has worked hard, sacrificed and taken risks to get where they are simply to throw at somebody who probably has not rather than provide support and training so that they too, if they work hard can succeed is wrong. If you simply redistribute success you take away the motivation to even bother to try to succeed and, the chances of having large successful companies to do what Palin rightfully did in Alaska diminishes.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 8:05 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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burnslikethesun
Posts: 13,027
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Sight my source.
I thought the large and CAPPED letters of FACT CHECK would have done the source quote for ya. Maybe its just me, but I would have caught it.
Again I ask, whats your definition of non tax payers.
Welfare sadly has a need to be. It keeps a lot of people from mugging our cherry ass as we walk down the streets in order to feed their family. Corporate Welfare has become a weekly event. Unless you purpose shipping every non tax payer out or lining them up to be shot, I dont hear another alternative coming from any of the republicans.
And Again I ask, What is the term one uses when the rich take from the poor?
You seemed to have side stepped that. Ya seem to side step all points, just repeated what ya had to say with and reword.
I can smell fear and anger driven beliefs 2000 miles away Vin. The problem with fear and anger is that its a judgment made without the benefit of intellect.
I don't have to have ever lived in Italy to make and stand firm by my next statement. I have lived across the USA in various places to know its true. Ready?
Italy is NOT America, Nor was America ever close or will be ever close to what Italy is or was. Seem Obama regardless of what you may fear him to think, knows and repeatably state, he answers to the AMERICAN PEOPLE FIRST FOREMOST AND ONLY. Hence the no pac money. What happens there won't and can't happen here. We've gone threw that growing pain, its time not to repeat it. Relax Vin, after thirty years here ya should have learned that by now.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 8:09 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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vinnytmd
Posts: 6,004
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burns, there are people that earn below the minimum amount to pay federal taxes. That is who. SO it is welfare.
What Palin did is EXACTLY what a good Governor should do. LOWER TAXES and return taxes that create a windfall.
It is so novel that Democrats cannot comprehend the idea! 
Italy is NOT America, Nor was America ever close or will be ever close to what Italy is or was
You are wrong. Economically we are heading right in their direction. How in this world can you say this if you have never lived in Europe?
Have you been emailing scammers for your data?
Please burns, you have passed your limitation here.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 8:11 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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Angel54214
Posts: 18,199
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The republicans spread it upwards.
The democrats spread it downward.
BJ...did you enjoy your 2nd tax refund this year? I heard we possibly will receive another one.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 8:11 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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burnslikethesun
Posts: 13,027
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if they work hard can succeed is wrong As is the lowest general labor that gave 30 years to his boss and traded wages for pension in hopes of a good retirement, to then retire and find his boss f***ed him out of his end of the deal, that took 30 years in its making.
I don't know, it may be the hill still left in my blood from generations past. But if you take my hog I have been fattening up of thirty years to eat the sweetest pig I can make, I'm gonna come looking for ya. I don't care where you sit on the social pile of life. Thief is a thief.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 8:52 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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sassycat
Posts: 251
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Where would the fear mongers be without Joe the NO SHOW plumber? Imagine having to result to using the idea that Obama wants to roll back the tax cuts to the 1% of the wealthiest which is FAILED REAGAN TRICKLE DOWN ECONOMICS as your only hope. It is obvious they are desperate, when all they can do is call Obama a terrorist socialist and use Joe the plumber a man who can't even afford to pay his taxes as their example. I wonder if that is why he didn't show today.
He is ashamed. And McCain was embarrassed. He couldnt' even stay on script. Yep, they chose to take the low road from the start because they can't win on the real issues so they make up names to call Obama. I can't believe sometimes that this is how they appeal to their base to continue to support their greed, bad decisions (war for oil) and the ruin of America, like school yard bullies. Ignorance should be painful. Well, it probably is painful to be a Republican right now. Don't worry, we have health care for you.
I mean health insurance. 
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 9:36 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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lefthandedluckie
Posts: 6,386
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The republicans on this thread and others talk about how we all should pay out of pocket for health care regardless if it can be afforded or not! 
Yet the republicans in congress has consistantly voted for full health care for themselves at the expense of U.S. Tax Payers! But, nothing from the right on this issue at all!
And repeatedly over and over and over and over they have voted against just nominal health care unless it is tied to some corporation they have stock in! Just look at the drug benefit they passed and how much it costs yearly because it is in the market place instead of in the Medicare Plan like it should be!
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 9:56 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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bardnsage
Posts: 1,171
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In the recent past many local governments realized huge windfalls when property values and taxes went through the roof.
Most municipalities spent it all.
An excellent point Vinnie. Not only did they spend it, but they projected their future income based on the housing bubble, which they knew was not valid. They did 7 year assesments, and set the value of your property to what the bubble would project the value to be in 7 years. Then they increased their budgets to match, so any correcton to the value or the rate, would be a CUT in government services.
Now, if the SOX laws requrie compaines to value property in real time, at market prices, (the catalyst to expose the bubble), why do our local governments not have to do the same thing.
How much property tax are you paying on the (assigned value) of your property, and not the market value.
I'm calling the tax office tomorrow, and ask (ask -- hah ) them to set the value of my home to current market values, as required by SOX on every public traded company. The dem's who run the local government will tail spin on that for at least a month, while they try to figure out how to keep the loot.
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 10:00 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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vinnytmd
Posts: 6,004
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Not only did they spend it, but they projected their future income based on the housing bubble, which they knew was not valid. They did 7 year assesments, and set the value of your property to what the bubble would project the value to be in 7 years. Then they increased their budgets to match, so any correcton to the value or the rate, would be a CUT in government services.
Good point. They did what people have been doing. All contributed to the current economy. Now we see cities, states and local Gov's are having their credit limits cut. SO they are in a pickle just like out of control people.
Some people never learn
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 10:05 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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blondhunger
Posts: 438
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Democrats have voted for health care right alongside the Republicans that you speak of. Obama's proposal to create more government infrastructure to manage health care will end up as all federally originated programs end up with inefficiency, greater costs than would be incurred by allowing the private sector to do what they are good at-running a business they know something about. The federal government knows nothing about running business-look at the way they screw it up.
A tax rebate the puts the money back in the hands of families who can decide for themselves and pick their own plan is much more feasible and cost effective. Keep the damn government out of our lives. Get it Democrats. Big government bad. A government that regulates less and taxes less-GOOD! 
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 10:43 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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lefthandedluckie
Posts: 6,386
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I am positive the Democrats voted right along side the republicans on all the health coverage available to congress! But, consistently the Democrats have tried and failed to institute health care for the entire nation! And the republicans have consistently voted against it unless some outside corporation could run it!
If that happened...it would cost billions and billions more than if a government program ran it!
But, never fear.....blondhunger.....I am all for this health care thing having an "opt out" box for all not wanting it! And more than that a tax deduction covering any taxes you would be out by opting out! And in the little blank provided you could say...I am opting out because I am a republican!
Just remember though....there will be no other plans from anybody. If there are you won't be able to afford it. Reason, everyone else will be on the government plan! There will be no need for insurance companies to provide health care insurance anymore...nor, will any HMO's exist either!
Look at the money you will save a month....maybe 25-30 dollars or more! But, you will not have to have that insurance!
Oh, there is one more thing....I certainly wish you and all the others long and happy lives! Just remember if something catastrophic hits you like...cancer or heart attack....you will have no insurance and will have to pay the cost of care at the going rates! And sad to say Georgie and his republican congress did away with your ability to Bankrupt! Alas, attachments will come for all your cars, trucks and houses until the debt is paid!
But, you were able to opt-out of that health care because you were a republican! Now, that "IS" the American way!
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 11:14 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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bardnsage
Posts: 1,171
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Well, with the decrease in the supply of dollars coming into the government, is not poor health care just the ticket from the TRICKLE UP crowd,,,, control demand, not supply. When they croak, they croak,,,,, and the government get's 50% (opps, 49%) of what's left over.
WHAT A BARGIN.
(oops again,,,, viva la mucho lagunda) Got to start practicing this....
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| Oct 30, 2008 @ 11:39 PM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats.
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willsmalto
Posts: 3,645
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hey listen up folks, it's not just a matter of spreading the wealth. bottom-up economics has always been proven to work more effectively than trickle- down economics. look back at the clinton years in the 90s. it's simple common sense. when the middle class does well, everybody's just fine.
it's unfortunate and fundamentally wrong that Bush wants to pass the shovel over to McCain. america today isn't ready for hole diggers 
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| Oct 31, 2008 @ 12:29 AM |
Spread the wealth they say, is a bad thing. Shame on us Democrats. |
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Angel54214
Posts: 18,199
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Before I even read this bill, some how I knew Africa is the tool Obama is using...
Global Poverty Act of 2007 (S. 2433)
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=s110-2433
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